2011-10-14 00:00 I guess the amount of flux was too low. I should have been submerged it entirely. 2011-10-14 00:03 wpwrak: any ideas of soldering 8WSON correctly? 2011-10-14 00:13 nevermind, it exploded 2011-10-14 00:13 leave exposed copper outside the chip. pre-tin pads and traces. ... 2011-10-14 00:14 ah yes, bake ;-) 2011-10-14 00:14 ah, that was not the chip 2011-10-14 00:14 it was a tantalum cap 2011-10-14 00:14 hm. 2011-10-14 00:14 the polarity _WAS_ correct 2011-10-14 00:14 see, that wouldn't have happened with an LDO ;-) 2011-10-14 00:15 no, really 2011-10-14 00:15 it quite definitely was correct 2011-10-14 00:15 why has that happened? 2011-10-14 00:15 the voltage is fine, too: cap is rated 25V, and I only give it 5V 2011-10-14 00:16 replace and try again ? 2011-10-14 00:16 yeah, tomorrow 2011-10-14 00:16 if I'll do it now, I will fry everything that is still possibly alive 2011-10-14 00:17 :) 2011-10-14 00:17 fffuuuu~~~. such a smell. 2011-10-14 00:18 the blast was nice, through. a bright flash, a loud clicking sound, a red-hot capacitor and a lot of crap spread on the boar 2011-10-14 00:18 *board 2011-10-14 00:19 am I correct that the red line on a yellow tantalum cap marks the positive electrode? 2011-10-14 00:19 good that you weren't examining anything nearby at the time 2011-10-14 00:19 yeah 2011-10-14 00:19 check the data sheet :) 2011-10-14 00:20 I don't have one 2011-10-14 00:20 as the cap was bought in Russia 2011-10-14 00:20 they've only state the manufacturer 2011-10-14 00:20 then assume the next time it's negative ;-))) 2011-10-14 00:20 it is "China". 2011-10-14 00:23 http://www.arduino.cc/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1257464508 2011-10-14 00:23 >This is why using tantalum capacitors in a power supply or for supply decoupling is not a good idea. Even when they are connected the right way round they can fail short circuit and burn like that. 2011-10-14 00:23 but they were recommended by TI in the step-down DS 2011-10-14 00:24 TI probably didn't mean Russian ones, I guess. 2011-10-14 00:25 i'm beginning to understand why the west was so afraid of you guys ;-) 2011-10-14 03:01 just double checked. we HAVE TO put the lockflash to the end of jtag command series. 2011-10-14 03:02 wpwrak, thanks. :) 2011-10-14 03:23 wrong channel. 2011-10-14 09:09 [commit] Werner Almesberger: m1rc3/norruption/2/collda: oops, only look for collateral damage on standby.fpg (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/wernermisc/cb024e1 2011-10-14 09:09 [commit] Werner Almesberger: m1rc3/norruption/2/dumplock: dump NOR locks (untested) (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/wernermisc/e0f8fc0 2011-10-14 09:24 [commit] Werner Almesberger: m1rc3/norruption/2/dumplock: use correct offset; fixed block number counting (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/wernermisc/a6136bd 2011-10-14 12:25 darn. that buck converter just does not work 2011-10-14 12:26 I've checked the schematic (~identical to the one in DS, and verified by common sense as well), pinout (fine), soldering (fine), shorts (fine) 2011-10-14 12:26 and I only maybe heated it for 30 sec at 330 deg. C with hot air 2011-10-14 12:27 it's tps62060 2011-10-14 12:27 its output is just zero, and that's it. 2011-10-14 12:32 any advices? 2011-10-14 12:40 current load is fine too? 2011-10-14 12:45 [commit] Xiangfu Liu: new package: Taskwarrior is a command-line todo list manager (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/461384d 2011-10-14 12:45 rejon_: ^ look at that ;-) 2011-10-14 12:49 that's a competitor to one of 'my programs' ;) 2011-10-14 12:51 fuck those chinese vendors, and especially blind/attention deficit me 2011-10-14 12:51 a piece of misplaced silkscreen has got between feedback pad and pin. 2011-10-14 12:51 at least, it _did_ on another board 2011-10-14 12:52 on _every_ another board 2011-10-14 12:52 chances that it did it on this one as well. 2011-10-14 12:53 kristianpaul: I've tried with open circuit (just output cap) and 1.8k resistor 2011-10-14 12:53 [commit] Xiangfu Liu: taskwarrior: update DEPENDS and description (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/1aed30c 2011-10-14 12:54 whitequark: btw what are you building? 2011-10-14 12:56 kristianpaul: a thingy for connecting an AT91SAM9G45 ARM board to a (one particluar) notebook LCD (which one my friend wants. as long as he understands that it will probably fail miserably _and_ cost him $100 in materials, it's fine imo) 2011-10-14 12:56 it accepts a TFT input and spits out LVDS 2011-10-14 12:56 also, there is a 5V->3.3V buck converter for backlight 2011-10-14 12:56 rejon_, http://en.qi-hardware.com/wiki/Applications#Taskwarrior  :-) 2011-10-14 12:56 oshw, of course. under wtfpl :) 2011-10-14 12:57 :) 2011-10-14 12:57 wwo that was fast xiangfu ;) 2011-10-14 12:57 unsolders that f..., oh I mean buck converter for 5th time 2011-10-14 12:58 whitequark: you should be more relaxed when unsoldering stuff :) 2011-10-14 12:59 surprisingly, I am probably improving my skill. at least it took 15 seconds and not five minutes now, hmm 2011-10-14 12:59 (either this, or it wasn't soldered at all) 2011-10-14 12:59 :D 2011-10-14 13:00 ahh. and _of course_ this board has perfectly fine silkscreen, just according to Murphy's law 2011-10-14 13:02 or maybe not 2011-10-14 13:02 does anyone know what can be used to wash off silkscreen? 2011-10-14 13:03 a sharp screwdriver does not help much 2011-10-14 13:05 acetone: no effect 2011-10-14 13:06 [commit] Xiangfu Liu: taskwarrior: rename package name to taskwarrior (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/3fd7a4a 2011-10-14 13:07 i found this http://en.qi-hardware.com/wiki/File:Normal_tools.png, who can translate what said above PC? 2011-10-14 13:07 i guess is the cleaner 2011-10-14 13:08 kristianpaul, yes. PCB board cleaner 2011-10-14 13:09 hum, i was hoping more details :) 2011-10-14 13:09 PC  --> PCB  :-) 2011-10-14 13:09 needs ask Adam when and how to use it. 2011-10-14 13:10 and what he thinks is made of 2011-10-14 13:21 [commit] Xiangfu Liu: gtypist: fix typo in DEPENDS (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/ecb69c7 2011-10-14 13:33 regarding the applications, "This page lists all the programs available in the latest OpenWRT distribution image." is this true ? or are also installable applications on the list ? 2011-10-14 13:34 kristianpaul: ok, now it _is_ soldered correctly. still the same result. 2011-10-14 13:37 (remove solder stop or silk screen) a knife should do for scratching. but be warned - the knife will also scratch away copper if used too much. 2011-10-14 13:37 whitequark: you have a good chance that your contacts aren't soldered. this sort of package is difficult. 2011-10-14 13:39 whitequark: also, can you see metal on the side ? or is it just the the bottom ? in the latter case, you would have to heat the solver via the copper, which would be very difficult with your large ground plane. 2011-10-14 13:40 (well, or use hot air. but careful with that, too.) 2011-10-14 13:41 wpwrak: I've did it with hot air. I can see the metal at the sides; actually, that's how I determined that it is actually soldered 2011-10-14 13:41 I've attached a needle to a multimeter and checked the connections 2011-10-14 13:41 for shorts too 2011-10-14 13:41 actually, I've checked that thrice. 2011-10-14 13:42 very good. then it could only be a bad chip or a design bug 2011-10-14 13:42 did you check the chip's orientation ? 2011-10-14 13:42 yep 2011-10-14 13:43 it's correct too, of course 2011-10-14 13:43 I've picked the datasheet, rotated the board to match the print and manually checked all the traces from the chip 2011-10-14 13:44 it is, uh, very simple. a couple of caps on input and output, a coil, a resistor feedback divider and a pull-down on EN pin 2011-10-14 13:44 that's it 2011-10-14 13:44 not a lot of places to screw up there 2011-10-14 13:45 EN should be pulled up 2011-10-14 13:45 actually, no-- the converter should be normally of 2011-10-14 13:46 also, I've checked it with both levels, just in case 2011-10-14 13:46 ah, okay. but you're pulling it up for testing then. 2011-10-14 13:46 sure 2011-10-14 13:46 do you see anything on SW ? (with a scope) 2011-10-14 13:46 hm, let me check 2011-10-14 13:48 (by the way, is DSO quad worth it? I currently have an analog Soviet scope, and it's kinda big and heavy. And it has a BW of 10MHz and the memory of how-much-can-you-fit-on-that-screen) 2011-10-14 13:48 you want a DSO ;-) 2011-10-14 13:48 i haven't seen any inexpensive quad-channel scopes with good memory, though 2011-10-14 13:49 the soviet one has only one channel 2011-10-14 13:49 I'm worried a bit about the resolution of DSO (8 bit), through 2011-10-14 13:49 does that matter? 2011-10-14 13:50 rigol makes decent low-cost (in the USD 500-1500 range) scopes with deep memory. only 2 channels, though. 2011-10-14 13:50 hmmm 2011-10-14 13:50 i am just thonking about getting one of the rigol 2011-10-14 13:50 RIGOL DS1052E 2011-10-14 13:50 this one specifically 2011-10-14 13:50 ahh, heard a lot about it 2011-10-14 13:51 looks like there are hw ans sw hacks to make a 100mhz 2011-10-14 13:51 8 bit usually is plenty. you can sweeze out more with averaging if you have periodic signals 2011-10-14 13:51 dso quad isn't really "quad" 2011-10-14 13:51 it only has two analog channels 2011-10-14 13:51 wpwrak: have you used the rigol scopes ? 2011-10-14 13:51 "false quad" that sounds unusual 2011-10-14 13:51 wpwrak: http://www.seeedstudio.com/wiki/DSO_Quad 2011-10-14 13:51 blogic: i have a DS1102CD 2011-10-14 13:52 dso quad is only $200. that's somewhat affordable for me, especially given its physical size. not sure if other characteristics are equally good, through 2011-10-14 13:53 is 4Ks of storage per channel enough? 2011-10-14 13:53 for what's basically a "pc scope", they skimped quite badly on memory 2011-10-14 13:55 yep 2011-10-14 13:55 I guess external memory was too expensive/hard to add 2011-10-14 13:55 (iirc cortex-m3's do not generally have memory controllers, and stm32 ones definitely do not) 2011-10-14 13:56 a good place in wich i can find math snipets implemented in C? any ideas? 2011-10-14 13:56 72 MSa/s is very low. the effective analog bandwidth is thus about 20 MHz with one channel, 10 MHz with two 2011-10-14 13:57 wpwrak: still better than my soviet scope. I doubt I can find more for $200 2011-10-14 13:57 i would still get the rigol :) 2011-10-14 13:58 or a clone https://www.sparkfun.com/products/10806 ? 2011-10-14 13:58 the DS1052E sounds quite decent to me. deep memory, sufficient sample rate, all the necessary controls. 2011-10-14 13:59 kristianpaul: a clone costs better. what do you think about quality? 2011-10-14 14:00 dunno... i would prefer a second hand rigol anyway :) 2011-10-14 14:00 are you using finally sdl-widgets?.. I would like to know how 2011-10-14 14:00 also this lack ethernet wich is not aceptable those days i think :) 2011-10-14 14:00 zrafa: me? 2011-10-14 14:00 kristianpaul: (clone) the comments say it's a tek clone. in this case, check the amount of memory it has :) 2011-10-14 14:00 kristianpaul: for what purpose is there ethernet on a scope? 2011-10-14 14:01 kristianpaul: no idea.. I replied the sdl-widgets mail explaining why it does not work in BEn, and I see that you have ported it 2011-10-14 14:01 besides that, teks are nice. handle better than rigols. but at equivalent specs, they're also considerably more expensive 2011-10-14 14:02 zrafa: i would like to use it, but need some time to learn the basis like making a fronted for sox like you did in jlime, remenber? 2011-10-14 14:02 kristianpaul: so I was thinking that you are starting to use sdl-widgets, and I would like to know how. it just works with mouse (the widgets) 2011-10-14 14:02 ahh 2011-10-14 14:02 wpwrak: (SW pin) nothing 2011-10-14 14:02 just mouse :/ 2011-10-14 14:02 kristianpaul: but.. did you understand my mail? 2011-10-14 14:02 kristianpaul: maybe I did not explain it well 2011-10-14 14:02 i dont 2011-10-14 14:02 kristianpaul: usb is also okay. sometimes even preferable. depends a bit on what you do. in the lab, ether or usb are pretty much the same. main difference is that you're more likely to find a web server on ether-connected devices. 2011-10-14 14:02 i took it as if you recomend it but warned about screen size problems? 2011-10-14 14:03 whitequark: remote managed or even scripting , well some scopes support that.. 2011-10-14 14:03 kristianpaul: no.. the screen size problem was my answer for some music composer program which uses mod and s3m 2011-10-14 14:03 whitequark: not good ... resistance of SW to ground ? (when the circuit is unpowered) 2011-10-14 14:03 kristianpaul: I did another answer for sdl-widgets werner found 2011-10-14 14:04 "The idea of those widgets are just to be used with mouse, no keyboard." 2011-10-14 14:04 ouch :) 2011-10-14 14:05 kristianpaul: time to roll up your sleeves ;-) 2011-10-14 14:05 kristianpaul: I think that I was the only fan of music in demos and intros here :) (which used mod and s3m, which I played for a while with those programs to compose music with samples) 2011-10-14 14:06 wpwrak: 2.78K 2011-10-14 14:06 good 2011-10-14 14:06 what is MODE set to ? 2011-10-14 14:06 what does that mean? 2011-10-14 14:06 kristianpaul: at that time I ported several "tangos" songs to mod using those programs.. 2011-10-14 14:07 wpwrak: (mode) high, i.e. fixed-freq 2011-10-14 14:07 it's connected to input power rail, directly 2011-10-14 14:07 it means "not open", "no shorted". that's all i can read from it ;-) 2011-10-14 14:07 kristianpaul: reading the music scores and then porting 2011-10-14 14:08 wpwrak: time to look for another inresting widget project ;) 2011-10-14 14:08 wpwrak: (sw) ah. same here. I'm sure it should not be shorted, but why not open? 2011-10-14 14:08 zrafa: btw tht youtube vide you passed, can actually sound same in the nanonote? 2011-10-14 14:08 because you have R1 and R2 2011-10-14 14:09 kristianpaul: the mods using tiny sound samples.. and they are combined, so yes, they should sound okey 2011-10-14 14:09 did you load the output ? 2011-10-14 14:09 kristianpaul: they were used by intros and demos 2011-10-14 14:09 wpwrak: I've put an 1.8k resistor there 2011-10-14 14:09 ah combining is the trick i see 2011-10-14 14:09 well, sounds pretty nice ! 2011-10-14 14:10 kristianpaul: they worked in older PC with dos 2011-10-14 14:10 whitequark: sounds good, too. time to re-check the pins, i guess. with special attention to ground and Vin 2011-10-14 14:11 wpwrak: okay 2011-10-14 14:11 oh, and did you measure SW-to-GND when the output was loaded with 1.8 kOhm ? 2011-10-14 14:12 wpwrak: nope, the load was disconnected 2011-10-14 14:12 so that was just R1+R2 2011-10-14 14:13 okay, I've rechecked pins, ensuring that I am touching the chip pads itself and not PCB ones 2011-10-14 14:13 they're fine 2011-10-14 14:14 when you connect power, does Vin look good ? and what current consumption do you get ? 2011-10-14 14:15 yeah, Vin is 5.06V (USB) 2011-10-14 14:15 current, hm 2011-10-14 14:15 I have had a special cable somewhere... 2011-10-14 14:17 2.5mA 2011-10-14 14:17 hmmmm 2011-10-14 14:17 and where do they go?.. 2011-10-14 14:18 the rest of the circuit ? or are you measuring just the converter ? 2011-10-14 14:18 yep 2011-10-14 14:18 A or B ? :) 2011-10-14 14:18 oh:) 2011-10-14 14:18 that 5V input is connected just to the converter 2011-10-14 14:18 nothing more 2011-10-14 14:18 and I'm mucking with it separately 2011-10-14 14:19 hmm. then you do indeed have a good question :) 2011-10-14 14:19 yep. 2011-10-14 14:19 are you sure your pins are really where you think you are ? e.g., is "top view" really "top view" ? 2011-10-14 14:19 s/think you are/think they are/ 2011-10-14 14:20 yes 2011-10-14 14:20 if they're correct in DS 2011-10-14 14:20 the chip looks like this 2011-10-14 14:20 . C6Y 2011-10-14 14:21 the . is on the ground, next pin is SW, next is GND, and so on 2011-10-14 14:21 the printing on the chip is vertical when the big connector on the board is on the bottom 2011-10-14 14:21 and the dot is on the right 2011-10-14 14:22 oh. 2011-10-14 14:22 it fucking works. 2011-10-14 14:22 how the hell?! 2011-10-14 14:22 ;-)) 2011-10-14 14:22 no, really. 2011-10-14 14:22 HOW?! 2011-10-14 14:22 perhaps you convinced it that there were no excuses left for not working ;-) 2011-10-14 14:22 maybe 2011-10-14 14:23 you could try gently pushing against components and see if it stops working 2011-10-14 14:24 defective solder joint, cracked traces, or broken bonding wires can all cause this sort of trouble 2011-10-14 14:25 well, the voltage changes when I touch feedback resistors, but that's normal 2011-10-14 14:25 ahhh, I have two ideas 2011-10-14 14:25 bonding wires are particularly nasty. there, the defect is INSIDE the chip 2011-10-14 14:26 (feedback change) yeah, they're very high-Z, so your finger makes a big difference 2011-10-14 14:26 also flux residues and such could heavily upset this circuit 2011-10-14 14:27 first. when I've changed my multimeter from voltage measurement to current measurement mode, I've replugged the probe, but it has correctly measured input voltage and checked the continuity ("beeping diode mode", not sure how is it called correctly) 2011-10-14 14:27 e.g., in atusb, i had flux mess with my reset timing. it contributed something like 100 kOhm. 2011-10-14 14:27 second. I've used a flux cleaning thingy--yes, that flux-off 2011-10-14 14:27 it is dimethoxymethane 2011-10-14 14:28 either this, or I have not dried it completely after bathing 2011-10-14 14:28 bathing = ultrasound bath ? 2011-10-14 14:28 yep 2011-10-14 14:28 what liquid did you use ? tap water ? 2011-10-14 14:29 it's filtered (not sure if you have same things in your country, but we do: it's an activated-carbon-filled (at least it looks like this way when disassembled) filter, you put tap water in, you get something better (and without any chlorine) out) 2011-10-14 14:29 and I've boiled it in a kettle 2011-10-14 14:30 poor man's distillation 2011-10-14 14:31 phew. so much work ;-) 2011-10-14 14:31 yeah 2011-10-14 14:31 but now I'm a bit wiser 2011-10-14 14:31 you could get demineralized water from car supplies 2011-10-14 14:31 yeah, I know. but I constantly forget about that. also, I'd need a whole lot of it 2011-10-14 14:31 *forget when I'm near the shop 2011-10-14 14:31 (for cooling. without additives. hmm, if they have that in russia :) 2011-10-14 14:32 don't know about car supplies, but I've seen that kind of water in electronics shop 2011-10-14 14:32 i have a DIY shop a few blocks away that has this sort of water in 5 l canisters. let's see how much it costs ... 2011-10-14 14:33 does it have, well, a website?! 2011-10-14 14:33 really? 2011-10-14 14:34 about USD 1.3 per liter 2011-10-14 14:34 http://www.easy.com.ar/easyapp/servlet/showDetalle.ev?ID_ARTICULO=10428&ID_SECCION=14&um=PCE 2011-10-14 14:34 then click on "Capital Federal y Bs. As." on the right 2011-10-14 14:35 I want to live in your country, whatever it is. DIY shops with websites, wow. 2011-10-14 14:35 (in the "Clientes NO registrados" box) 2011-10-14 14:35 ;-))) 2011-10-14 14:35 zrafa: do you hear ? the recruiting of new immigrants is progressing well :) 2011-10-14 14:35 $10 for 5l. that's nice 2011-10-14 14:36 $ = pesos. oh, sorry ... it's less than USD 1.3 per liter. only about ... USD 0.50 2011-10-14 14:37 so, $5. even better 2011-10-14 14:40 grmbl. x server hang :-( 2011-10-14 14:47 [commit] Werner Almesberger: m1rc3/norruption/2/dumpotp: quick and dirty script to dump the OTP memory (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/wernermisc/97af8ea 2011-10-14 14:54 whitequark: yeah, about 51 US-cents per liter of distilled water. affordable :) 2011-10-14 14:56 hah. I'm doing the final cleaning, as I've not bothered to clean it each time I've moved the chip 0.1mm to some random direction 2011-10-14 14:56 wonder if will work afterwards 2011-10-14 14:57 hmmmm. is that water in ultrasonic bath boiling? 2011-10-14 14:57 or is that just the fog? 2011-10-14 14:58 I couldn't tell easily. It's hot. 2011-10-14 14:59 ;-))))) 2011-10-14 15:00 it's supposed to be room temperature 2011-10-14 15:00 not for this particular cleaner, I guess 2011-10-14 15:00 that is, unless your have an ultrasound cleaner with heating. i guess there's no harm in exposing your circuit to 100 C, though 2011-10-14 15:00 it has, ahem 2011-10-14 15:01 it does not supposed to have a heater. 2011-10-14 15:01 *is not 2011-10-14 15:01 but it has a very chinese power supply 2011-10-14 15:02 (yes, that's an adjective) 2011-10-14 15:02 one of those days, one of your "special" devices will kill you ... 2011-10-14 15:03 that's not very unlikely, yes 2011-10-14 15:04 (regarding that. I have -- yes, have -- a friend who once had a Soviet scope with a failed power plug. yes, the 220V one. when it did not worked, he pushed the exposed metal bars into the socket with his bare hands) 2011-10-14 15:04 somehow (surprisingly) he is still alive 2011-10-14 15:05 and does all sorts of weird stuff from refrigerators to solid-body lasers 2011-10-14 15:08 wpwrak: distilled water for cooling?? WTF? highly deprecated, will etch away your car's cooler 2011-10-14 15:08 well, some people worry about how they'll live when they're too old to work. at least he seems to be free of such concerns :) 2011-10-14 15:08 exactly 2011-10-14 15:08 DocScrutinizer: maybe it's for something else. but in any case, they sell it in the cars stuff section 2011-10-14 15:08 DocScrutinizer: etches? really? it's distilled water. isn't it supposed to not contain anything except H2O? 2011-10-14 15:09 yep, for lead-acid bateries 2011-10-14 15:09 could be. next to it, they have water "with additives". no idea what these do, though. 2011-10-14 15:09 it's diluting any chalk that's already coating the cooler insdie, and it also dilutes the metal partially 2011-10-14 15:11 I've been puzzled as well that it's *that* bad, but I heard it several times: do NOT use distilled water for cooler refill 2011-10-14 15:11 whitequark: you mean this stuff ? http://www.dhmo.org/facts.html 2011-10-14 15:13 wpwrak: :)) yeah, it's a well-known joke 2011-10-14 15:20 whitequark: cleaning with distilled or even clean tap water is OK, but you should finally rinse the board with 99% alcohol which is hygroscopic and will remove water from locations you can't reach with pressurized air etc 2011-10-14 15:22 DocScrutinizer: thanks, I'll do 2011-10-14 15:22 though virtually all of the residual substances fund after manufacturing/repair/rework are not water soluble, so water is useful only to clean board that suffered from spilled coke, coffee etc 2011-10-14 15:22 s/fund/found/ 2011-10-14 15:23 as e.g sugar is hardly soluble in alcohol and non-polar solvents 2011-10-14 15:23 afaik 2011-10-14 15:24 yeah, but I'm not sure if ultrasonic bathing of the board with 99% alcohol is a good idea 2011-10-14 15:25 well, I'm not sure if ultrasonic bath is a good idea at all 2011-10-14 15:25 flux-off (dimethoxymethane) does something with the flux so it almost completely goes away, and bathing gets rid of what remains after flux-off 2011-10-14 15:26 as you can see from the image, this produces quite good results 2011-10-14 15:26 oh, the image: http://imgur.com/kClLl 2011-10-14 15:26 it's removing things by cavitation erosion (building up microscopic "vacuum" bubbles on the surface, that - when collapsing - really do hard impact on the surface) 2011-10-14 15:26 yeah, I know 2011-10-14 15:27 might even remove thin copper coatings etc 2011-10-14 15:29 wpwrak: recruiting : ;-)) .. and you just promoted some DIY shops.. :) 2011-10-14 15:30 ? 2011-10-14 15:31 I just applied to a really blaergh job, so who's recruiting and do they pay good? 2011-10-14 15:37 water also removes water-soluble flux. and yes, you can use pure alcohol i an ultrasound bath. 2011-10-14 15:38 the main issue with ultrasound is resonance. the better devices (for cleaning electronics) therefore vary their frequency. 2011-10-14 15:44 wpwrak: I definitely can, but it is _not_ easy to get large quantities of pure alcohol here, guess why. 2011-10-14 15:45 I have a 5l canister, and it is, well, valuable :D 2011-10-14 15:47 use one of the other alcohols then, methanol, isopropanol 2011-10-14 15:48 doesn't really mater as long as it's pure (not that 70% stuff) 2011-10-14 15:48 I'm afraid of methanol (as of any other quite poisonous easily evaporated substance), through isopropanol may be a way to go 2011-10-14 15:49 Does anyone know about Nanonote Manufacturing, who should i contact ? 2011-10-14 15:51 whitequark: yeah, i was thinking of isopropanol. not your 5 l canister of premium vodka ;-) 2011-10-14 15:52 methanol is relatively harmless, it's the formaldehyde that your liver produces from methanol that's the problem (that's why you get huge amounts of ethanol in hospital when they diagnose and tread a methanol intoxication. Same liver enzymes that methabolize ethanol to acetaldehyde also are producing formaldehyde from methanol, so diluting methanol with ethanol helps to reduce the formaldehyde level in blood) 2011-10-14 15:52 qwebirc56550: i guess that depends a bit on what exactly you're after. but probably wolfgang 2011-10-14 15:53 s/tread/treat/ 2011-10-14 15:53 Yes a saw his name, but i''m new here, how can I contact him ? 2011-10-14 15:54 DocScrutinizer: so to get your doctors to give you a prescription for lots of booze, you need to tell them you had consumed some methanol ? interesting 2011-10-14 15:54 DocScrutinizer: yeah, I know that. this does not changes the fact that it is dangerous to work with 2011-10-14 15:54 that'S what worked several times already, yes 2011-10-14 15:54 qwebirc56550: either lurk here or send mail: Wolfgang Spraul 2011-10-14 15:54 wpwrak: that's not vodka, just some pure alcohol :D it has happened to get to me untouched somehow. I don't quite recall how I got it 2011-10-14 15:54 now we know DocScrutinizer's secret :) 2011-10-14 15:55 thanks a lot ! 2011-10-14 15:57 whitequark: temporary memory loss is often associated with in vivo quality control of ethanol :) 2011-10-14 16:08 wpwrak: :) somehow the things has arranged in an interesting way: I haven't ever drinked anything alcohol-containing 2011-10-14 16:08 i.e. in my entire life 2011-10-14 16:09 or at least you don't remember such events ? :) 2011-10-14 16:11 :) 2011-10-14 16:11 nor does anyone else 2011-10-14 16:12 (lack of memory) at least that's how you should express it to avoid tarnishing russia's hard-earned reputation 2011-10-14 16:12 (anyone else) hmm, social drinking would explain this :) 2011-10-14 16:14 I don't really think it is a good reputation, especially given that it is very close to truth 2011-10-14 16:16 hah. http://cds.linear.com/docs/Application%20Note/an25fa.pdf : look at the last page 2011-10-14 16:18 also, read every other one. 2011-10-14 17:18 have you ever seen drunk capacitors? http://easyelectronics.ru/img/Instrument/ProskitSS217/sx_proskit.jpg 2011-10-14 17:25 also the voltage regulators look a little tipsy 2011-10-14 17:38 LOL 2011-10-14 17:41 AT98C2051 \o/ my private pet 2011-10-14 17:42 awesome lil critter 2011-10-14 17:42 huh? have you developed it? :) 2011-10-14 17:42 89 of course, not 98 2011-10-14 17:45 not that I'd be surprised if you did 2011-10-14 17:52 not exactly, just had an own design with it (pusteflipper, easy to google) - the PCB for that one looked nicer than the one linked above though: http://maemo.cloud-7.de/dscf33* 2011-10-14 18:21 DocScrutinizer: that URL does not work 2011-10-14 18:23 googled it (the device). what the hell it does?! 2011-10-14 18:29 http://maemo.cloud-7.de/dscf3349.jpg http://maemo.cloud-7.de/dscf3350.jpg 2011-10-14 18:32 the controller operates some 5 LED/phototransistor light barriers, and flash some LEDs and move some magnets 2011-10-14 18:34 2000 2011-10-14 18:35 it's quite ancient 2011-10-14 18:35 yup 2011-10-14 18:36 back when I had a real "company name" jrwsoft 2011-10-14 18:36 running a real company is a PITA though, so I stopped that ;-D 2011-10-14 18:39 btw the whole device is a medical aid for kids with problems to speak correctly - you blow a small plaic ball with a straw (or without) and manage it into some target holes 2011-10-14 18:40 weird 2011-10-14 18:40 kinda micro table air minigolf 2011-10-14 18:40 plastic* 2011-10-14 18:41 the controller gives a kind of scoring and feedback 2011-10-14 18:42 btw "flipper" is the german name for pinball 2011-10-14 18:42 and "puste" is...? 2011-10-14 18:42 blow 2011-10-14 18:42 so it's blow-pinball 2011-10-14 18:43 which pretty exactly describes the whole thing 2011-10-14 18:44 http://mausklick-produktion.de/ upper left and right shows it better than I could describe here 2011-10-14 18:58 yeah, I see 2011-10-14 21:32 wpwrak: thanks 2011-10-14 21:32 I ditched the solder paste completely and just pre-tinned each pad 2011-10-14 21:32 also, LOADS OF FLUX 2011-10-14 21:32 I was able to make a second such board in less than a hour 2011-10-14 21:32 have I mentioned flux? :D 2011-10-14 22:25 is sebastian here?.. He will like this video : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qwIAjB99ucw 2011-10-14 22:25 it is like X but 30 years older 2011-10-14 22:25 :) 2011-10-14 23:12 whitequark: congrats ! ;-) 2011-10-14 23:17 good morning everybody 2011-10-14 23:18 zrafa: revolutionary !