2011-04-05 00:50 <wpwrak> tuxbrain: btw, when you get the boards from adam, you may want to try the user space tools to check that things work. that's still the most "useful" process to date: http://lists.en.qi-hardware.com/pipermail/discussion/2011-March/007587.html
2011-04-05 07:53 <panda|x201> wolfspra1l, ping
2011-04-05 07:53 <panda|x201> xiangfu, ping
2011-04-05 08:00 <xiangfu> panda|x201: pong
2011-04-05 08:51 <whitequa1k> xiangfu: what about jzboot integration? I've sent you a reply
2011-04-05 08:53 <xiangfu> whitequa1k: sorry. I put too much time on milkymist one recently. sorry.
2011-04-05 08:54 <xiangfu> whitequa1k: I was thinking. we can add support nanonote to jzboot. then we can just delete the usbboot in future. and keep the xbboot.
2011-04-05 08:55 <xiangfu> whitequa1k: do you think we should merge to source code repo?
2011-04-05 08:55 <xiangfu> s/to/two
2011-04-05 08:55 <kyak> what's the difference between jzboot and usbboot?
2011-04-05 08:57 <whitequa1k> xiangfu: no problem, I just wanted to be sure that my letter wan't eaten by spam-filter or something like that
2011-04-05 08:58 <xiangfu> usbboot source code is very very bad. the target source code are copy  from ingenic.cn
2011-04-05 08:58 <xiangfu> kyak: only the target image source code is bad :)
2011-04-05 08:58 <kyak> so you mean that jzboot is much cleaner?
2011-04-05 08:58 <kyak> what about the functionality?
2011-04-05 08:58 <xiangfu> kyak: I think so.
2011-04-05 08:59 <whitequa1k> I don't think that merging repositories is a good idea, jzboot is completely different from usbboot
2011-04-05 08:59 <kyak> xiangfu: i'm thinking about that bug in latest usbboot, that corrupted the bootloader. Maybe it'll work good in jzboot?
2011-04-05 09:00 <whitequa1k> I think you can set up a repo for 'qi-jzboot' and then we'll add all relevant changes to it
2011-04-05 09:00 <xiangfu> whitequa1k: where is the source code of firmware in jzboot
2011-04-05 09:01 <whitequa1k> also, it uses target images from usbboot/ingenic. the main difference is in host functionality
2011-04-05 09:01 <xiangfu> whitequa1k: so you don't have touch the firmware source code. only the host app?
2011-04-05 09:02 <whitequa1k> yeah
2011-04-05 09:02 <whitequa1k> the host app was rewrittten from scratch, through
2011-04-05 09:02 <xiangfu> whitequa1k:maybe the first step is include the 'jzboot' in debian package xburst-tools. :)
2011-04-05 09:03 <xiangfu> whitequa1k: ok. understand now.
2011-04-05 09:03 <whitequa1k> then it makes sense to include jzboot in your repo, yeah
2011-04-05 09:03 <xiangfu> whitequa1k: hmm.. then the sync will be a problem. I will ask debian people if the package can build base on two repo :)
2011-04-05 09:05 <xiangfu> kyak: if they using the firmware from ingenic.cn.  then jzboot will be the same as lastest usbboot.
2011-04-05 09:06 <kyak> xiangfu: does it mean that older usbboot wasn't using the firmware from ingenic?
2011-04-05 09:06 <whitequa1k> xiangfu: I mean that we can just include it in a subdirectory, not merging anything (in this context word merge can have different meanings), and then it won't be a problem to build the package
2011-04-05 09:06 <whitequa1k> I think it's OK to make repository on qi-hardware the main one for jzboot
2011-04-05 09:07 <xiangfu> whitequa1k: oh. yes. a subdirectory will not a problem
2011-04-05 09:07 <kyak> xiangfu: this is strange, i'm using the same firmware with both older and latest usbboot, but only latest usbboot has this problem
2011-04-05 09:08 <whitequa1k> kyak: the firmware has some glitches , which have workarounds in jzb[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[Doot
2011-04-05 09:09 <whitequa1k> oop
2011-04-05 09:09 <kyak> --)
2011-04-05 09:09 <whitequa1k> okay, I'll find a better internet connection then
2011-04-05 09:09 <whitequa1k> I'll return in ~2 hours
2011-04-05 09:10 <xiangfu> whitequa1k: (main one for jzboot) . ok talk to you when you back :)
2011-04-05 09:14 <xiangfu> kyak: which commit of the older usbboot?
2011-04-05 09:24 <xiangfu> kyak: can you test reflash twice u-boot on your nanonote. ?
2011-04-05 09:56 <kyak> xiangfu: i reflashed in several million times :)
2011-04-05 09:56 <kyak> it doesn't help
2011-04-05 09:57 <kyak> xiangfu: which commit - i don't know. I tested the old release (mentioned in my e-mail back then) and the latest one from git
2011-04-05 11:46 <whitequa1k> xiangfu: I'm here
2011-04-05 11:48 <xiangfu> whitequa1k: Hi   (main one for jzboot)  so we make a sub-folder under xburst-tools?
2011-04-05 11:48 <whitequa1k> yeah
2011-04-05 11:48 <xiangfu> whitequa1k: ok. great. I remember I saw some document that we can import all git history to another git sub-folder.
2011-04-05 11:49 <whitequa1k> that is called 'git submodules'
2011-04-05 11:49 <tuxbrain> wpwrak aw_ parcel with atben atusb and jtag had just arrived :)
2011-04-05 11:50 <xiangfu> whitequa1k: oh. do you have an account in projects.qi-hardware.com?
2011-04-05 11:50 <whitequa1k> no
2011-04-05 11:51 <whitequa1k> I'll register now then
2011-04-05 11:51 <aw_> tuxbrain, pls just send to list then we can view it. :-)
2011-04-05 11:52 <tuxbrain> I have a lot of other work to do but I will try to follow the wpwrak howto asap and do some post about it, also sugru is on its way so I will also make some lamer test on if it cause any perceptible effect
2011-04-05 11:52 <aw_> tuxbrain, sorry that I was thought it's the panelized gerber. :-)
2011-04-05 11:53 <tuxbrain> aw_:  no was your pàrcel :P the pcb maker is not so quick :P
2011-04-05 11:53 <aw_> tuxbrain, yup...;-)
2011-04-05 11:56 <whitequa1k> xiangfu: done, username is whitequark
2011-04-05 11:57 <tuxbrain> wpwrak: the atusb is making my dmesg crazy http://pastebin.com/Q25rmNX7 :P
2011-04-05 11:57 <xiangfu> whitequark: add you as the project admin :) http://projects.qi-hardware.com/index.php/p/xburst-tools/
2011-04-05 11:58 <xiangfu> whitequark: then you have the write access to xburst-tools.
2011-04-05 11:59 <whitequark> xiangfu: good. I'm waiting for ssh key to propagate itself
2011-04-05 12:01 <xiangfu> whitequark: for add jzboot to xburst-tools just run "cd xburst-tools && git submodule add /PATH/to/jzboot/ jzboot" right?
2011-04-05 12:01 <xiangfu> whitequark: I don't this command before.
2011-04-05 12:03 <xiangfu> I don't know this command before.
2011-04-05 12:07 <whitequark> xiangfu: yeah, but it is better to use a remote repository, so that everyone may clone the submodule
2011-04-05 12:09 <whitequark> I currently have one on git.whitequark.org, but maybe it makes sense to set up a qi-hardware project in the case whitequark.org goes down
2011-04-05 12:10 <xiangfu> whitequark: sure.
2011-04-05 12:12 <xiangfu> whitequark: after you create the jzboot.git in qi-hardawre. you merge those two repo is better. never use the 'git submodule' before
2011-04-05 12:23 <whitequark> xiangfu: hmm, how can I create a project in qi-hardware?
2011-04-05 12:26 <xiangfu> whitequark: sorry. I don't know if normal user can create project in qi-hardware.
2011-04-05 12:26 <xiangfu> whitequark: I just create one named 'jzboot' : http://projects.qi-hardware.com/index.php/p/jzboot/
2011-04-05 12:26 <xiangfu> add you as the admin.
2011-04-05 12:28 <xiangfu> there should be a 'Project Management' tab after you goto http://projects.qi-hardware.com/index.php/p/jzboot/. you can update the detail there. add members. etc.
2011-04-05 12:32 <whitequark> yeah, already
2011-04-05 12:34 <qi-bot> [commit] Peter Zotov: Added jzboot as submodule. http://qi-hw.com/p/xburst-tools/9546fde
2011-04-05 12:34 <whitequark> ditto
2011-04-05 12:37 <whitequark> probably I need to include jzboot to autoconf build now. hm, I've never had any autoconf experience
2011-04-05 12:38 <xiangfu> updating my local xburst-tools
2011-04-05 12:42 <xiangfu> whitequark: after update local xburst-tools. the jzboot folder is empty. what should I do ?
2011-04-05 12:43 <xiangfu> running "git submodule update --init jzboot/"
2011-04-05 12:51 <xiangfu> whitequark: I made a small patch for jzboot.
2011-04-05 12:53 <whitequark> xiangfu: have you pushed it?
2011-04-05 12:53 <xiangfu> whitequark: not yet. I still not very clear how submodules works. needs add one Makefile.am to the jzboot.
2011-04-05 12:54 <whitequark> the submodule is basically a link to a particular commit in other repository
2011-04-05 12:54 <whitequark> so when you fetch a commit X from main repository, and run 'git submodule update', it will always fetch commit Y (recorded in .gitmodules) from the submodule repo
2011-04-05 12:55 <whitequark> the submodule itself is a perfectly normal git repository
2011-04-05 12:55 <whitequark> so, after you update the submodule (i.e. checkout other commit in the subdirectory), you need to commit the parent repo as well
2011-04-05 12:55 <xiangfu> whitequark: so for add a new file Makefile.am . I have to push it to jzboot.git?
2011-04-05 12:55 <whitequark> yes
2011-04-05 13:00 <whitequark> will qi-bot announce commits in jzboot?
2011-04-05 13:00 <wolfspra1l> not yet :-)
2011-04-05 13:02 <xiangfu> whitequark: I will add me as the jzboot.git member. then add the new file Makefile.am
2011-04-05 13:02 <whitequark> xiangfu: I've already added you
2011-04-05 13:08 <xiangfu> is adding jzboot to qi-bot.
2011-04-05 13:11 <xiangfu> ok. wolfgang is faster then me. :)
2011-04-05 13:12 <qi-bot> [commit] Xiangfu Liu: add Makefile.am for xburst-tools autoconf http://qi-hw.com/p/jzboot/da72c35
2011-04-05 13:15 <qi-bot> [commit] Xiangfu Liu: add jzboot to build system http://qi-hw.com/p/xburst-tools/461712a
2011-04-05 13:15 <whitequark> hm, that was easy
2011-04-05 13:15 <whitequark> ah no, it wants Makefile.in
2011-04-05 13:16 <jow_laptop> :D :D
2011-04-05 13:16 <xiangfu> whitequark: ./autogen.sh && ./configure CROSS_COMPILE=mipsel-openwrt-linux-
2011-04-05 13:16 <whitequark> autogen.sh fails
2011-04-05 13:17 <whitequark> ah yes. that's exactly the thing I hate about submodules
2011-04-05 13:17 <xiangfu> whitequark: I am under xburst-tools.git. it show me that "modified:   jzboot" what I should do before run "git submodule update' ?
2011-04-05 13:18 <whitequark> now you need to do 'git add jzboot; git commit'
2011-04-05 13:19 <whitequark> that will record the fact jzboot HEAD has changed in .gitmodules of xburst-tools
2011-04-05 13:30 <qi-bot> [commit] Xiangfu Liu: those file auto created by automake system http://qi-hw.com/p/jzboot/ce7446f
2011-04-05 13:32 <qi-bot> [commit] Xiangfu Liu: update jzboot http://qi-hw.com/p/xburst-tools/1eaeb7d
2011-04-05 13:33 <xiangfu> whitequark: now. it's clear now.
2011-04-05 13:33 <xiangfu> whitequark: what is the error of your 'autogen.sh' ?
2011-04-05 13:34 <whitequark> that was caused by nonexistent Makefile.am because jzboot has not updated
2011-04-05 13:34 <whitequark> it's fine now
2011-04-05 13:35 <tuxbrain> roh wpwrak aw_ wolfspra1l sugru also arrives... sigh why by the love of $DEITY fun stuff arrives when your plenty of boooring stuff to take care off
2011-04-05 13:36 <whitequark> xiangfu: jzboot has readline support, but currently it's enabled by compiling make READLINE=1
2011-04-05 13:36 <whitequark> I wonder how that should be hooked into autoconf
2011-04-05 13:38 <xiangfu> needs add one option to './configure.ac' and the 'jzboot/makefile.am' check the ./configure.ac line 12.
2011-04-05 13:39 <xiangfu> there is a '--enalbe-firmware' '--disable-firmware' in configure now. for enable/disable firmware under usbboot
2011-04-05 13:40 <whitequark> okay, I'll do that
2011-04-05 13:41 <xiangfu> usbboot/src/Makefile.am line 15
2011-04-05 13:41 <xiangfu> whitequark: thanks
2011-04-05 13:48 <whitequark> why there is a .mailmap file in xburst-tools root?
2011-04-05 13:50 <tuxbrain> btw guys another topic question... what people do you think about RFID technology? Is a pantent trap? I think a rfid-6lowpan device can be cool by itself but also a good complement for nanonote as datalogger.
2011-04-05 13:56 <xiangfu> whitequark: it's commit by Jonathan Nieder, for 'git shorlog'
2011-04-05 13:59 <whitequark> sure, but what purpose it has? I've never seen that before
2011-04-05 14:00 <wpwrak> tuxbrain: (parcel arrived) wonderful ! and great timing ! ;-)
2011-04-05 14:01 <wpwrak> tuxbrain: (atusb) hmm, both of them ?
2011-04-05 14:05 <tuxbrain> wpwrak: (atusb) no, the atusb6 is the crazy one, the 7 gives me [192239.352519] usb 2-1: new full speed USB device using uhci_hcd and address 90
2011-04-05 14:05 <tuxbrain> [192239.480312] usb 2-1: device descriptor read/64, error -71
2011-04-05 14:05 <tuxbrain> [192239.965081] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
2011-04-05 14:06 <tuxbrain> and a pretty lsusb
2011-04-05 14:06 <tuxbrain> Bus 002 Device 091: ID 20b7:1540
2011-04-05 14:07 <xiangfu> whitequark: I guess it's for "debian/changelog.upstream.awk"
2011-04-05 14:07 <whitequark> xiangfu: ah right, thanks
2011-04-05 14:07 <whitequark> I'm currently converting the entire jzboot to automake
2011-04-05 14:07 <xiangfu> whitequark: we need cleanup the debian build code. since we don't using the git commit any more. instead we start to release the source tar ball.
2011-04-05 14:14 <wpwrak> tuxbrain: (atusb6) hmm. maybe the USB reset problem has a time component. or some hardware issue re-appeared. do you have something that can measure frequency up to > 1 MHz ? (ideally, 8 MHz, but anything above 1 MHz should do)
2011-04-05 14:15 <tuxbrain> wpwrak: nop
2011-04-05 14:17 <tuxbrain> I doubt my old faithfull digital voltmeter can do what you said, or maybe yes but my eyes  can't pericive the fluctuations  >0,01MHz
2011-04-05 14:19 <whitequark> tuxbrain: ahem... do you want to say you can catch 10kHz with your eyes?
2011-04-05 14:19 <whitequark> that's pretty impressive
2011-04-05 14:20 <jlamothe> Clearly you're superman.  :)
2011-04-05 14:20 <tuxbrain> nah! just trained with codificated porn films during my adolescense
2011-04-05 14:22 <tuxbrain> In spain there is a full male generation able to do that :)
2011-04-05 14:25 <tuxbrain> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNsxAPWY7xs
2011-04-05 14:25 <zumbi> lol
2011-04-05 14:26 <tuxbrain> hehehe zumbi is another one of those :P
2011-04-05 14:30 <wpwrak> tuxbrain: (no instruments) hmm, could also be that it just doesn't have the correct firmware. i expected that we'd have to reflash for some updates anyway, so i didn't particularly check. you can change the firmware with the process described here: http://lists.en.qi-hardware.com/pipermail/discussion/2011-March/007641.html
2011-04-05 14:30 <wpwrak> tuxbrain: programming would be the  make prog-app  step
2011-04-05 14:32 <wpwrak> tuxbrain: there are basically four things that can cause problems with USB: 1) a problem in the USB-ATmega32U2 side connection. that should be very unlikely (could happen in production, though, e.g., if they produce a short across one of the TVS)
2011-04-05 14:34 <wpwrak> tuxbrain: 2) the yet unresolved USB reset/enumeration problem on its own. that is just a guess. 3) having both DFU and application in the flash. that would cause them to cycle endlessly through reset, due to the USB reset problem. the solution is to just flash the application, without flashing the DFU boot loader.
2011-04-05 14:35 <tuxbrain> wpwrak: roger, I will try to reflash it today night or tomorrow, now I must leave
2011-04-05 14:36 <wpwrak> tuxbrain: 4) if the ATmega32U2 fails to switch the clock speed. the transceiver produced a 1 MHz clock after reset. the MCU needs 8 MHz, so it tells the transceiver to switch. if this goes wrong, the system will run at an incorrect speed.
2011-04-05 14:36 <tuxbrain> wpwrak: btw pretty impresive piece of artesany both atben/atusb.... do you think about dedicate to jewelry?
2011-04-05 14:37 <wpwrak> (jewelry) thanks ! maybe we should start a fashion trend that uses electronic as jewelry ;-)
2011-04-05 14:41 <tuxbrain> ad 6lowpan biometrics to this and you have a win product :)
2011-04-05 14:41 <tuxbrain> btw wpwrak what do you think about RFID tech?
2011-04-05 14:42 <tuxbrain> must leave read you later
2011-04-05 15:59 <qi-bot> [commit] Peter Zotov: Changed everything to use autotools. http://qi-hw.com/p/jzboot/8b4338f
2011-04-05 16:00 <qi-bot> [commit] Peter Zotov: Adjusted configure.ac to search for libraries required for jzboot. http://qi-hw.com/p/xburst-tools/c26a0ce
2011-04-05 16:02 <whitequark> xiangfu: I've ported that to autotools. even with fancy --with-readline switch
2011-04-05 16:03 <wpwrak> tuxbrain: (rfid) no idea. i don't know the use cases too well. okay, except as fancy bar codes.
2011-04-05 16:05 <xiangfu> whitequark: cool.
2011-04-05 16:07 <whitequark> i'll try to hook up debian packaging for jzboot then
2011-04-05 16:13 <tuxbrain> wpwrak: animal control on farms, logistics, personal identification for security... but yes all uses cases can be sumarized on fancy bar codes :)
2011-04-05 16:16 <tuxbrain> what I mean is to have an auntonomouse device with 6lowpan and rdif reader to integrate in a 6lowpan network, but I don't know is rfid is pantent tainted technology or how dificult is to implement
2011-04-05 16:16 <tuxbrain> dificult=costs
2011-04-05 16:28 <wpwrak> tuxbrain: don't know about RFID IPR issues either
2011-04-05 16:29 <tuxbrain> IPR (Intellectual property reclaim?)
2011-04-05 16:29 <C-Keen> rights I guess
2011-04-05 16:29 <wpwrak> tuxbrain: if you have some RFID thingy that tasks plain SPI, there should be no problem connecting it to a 6LoWPAN device. there are a lot of MCU+IEEE 802.15.4 chips, and many of then are supported by contiki
2011-04-05 16:30 <wpwrak> tuxbrain: Intellectual "Property" "Rights"
2011-04-05 16:30 <C-Keen> wpwrak: "intellectual" too
2011-04-05 16:31 <wpwrak> C-Keen: heh, particularly when combined with the other two :)
2011-04-05 16:32 <C-Keen> wpwrak: they always play together
2011-04-05 16:46 <tuxbrain> wprack so, maybe UBB+ this http://www.cutedigi.com/product_info.php?cPath=278_299&products_id=4365&osCsid=76ba07b577801bae061ddb65ed61062d = NanoNote RFID reader/writer?
2011-04-05 16:47 <tuxbrain> what to add to the avove module to have a tinny to make autonomous 6lowpan?
2011-04-05 16:49 <tuxbrain> due then NN+atben +RFID thing = example on how to expand Nanonote wiressly
2011-04-05 16:49 <tuxbrain> wiressly-> wirelessly
2011-04-05 17:03 <tuxbrain> or maybe better with this one http://www.priority1design.com.au/rfidread-mrw.pdf
2011-04-05 17:03 <wpwrak> tuxbrain: for an autonomous wireless system, you could use, say, the freescale mc13224v
2011-04-05 17:04 <wpwrak> tuxbrain: that's an arm7 (plus RF). even has the balun integrated. a bit difficult to solder, though - sort of a hybrid between QFN and BGA
2011-04-05 17:05 <whitequa1k> it's also cheap for such a good soc
2011-04-05 17:06 <whitequa1k> $9 here
2011-04-05 17:06 <whitequa1k> btw, can anyone suggest an easy-to-use 2.4GHz transciever with no external components?
2011-04-05 17:09 <wpwrak> whitequa1k: you mean a chip (which probably doesn't exist) or a module ?
2011-04-05 17:10 <wpwrak> whitequa1k: also, what do you do with the rf signal ? antenna or connector would be "external components", right ? so it has to be a module then
2011-04-05 17:11 <tuxbrain> wpwrak: I think can have access to someone able to solder it.... so in theory connecting this freescale to the avobe rfidreader, some source of power and we are done?
2011-04-05 17:11 <whitequa1k> wpwrak: a chip. I've found TI's CC2500, but a few people that worked with it complain to unstabilites
2011-04-05 17:11 <whitequa1k> it technically requires only several caps and a PCB antenna
2011-04-05 17:16 <wpwrak> whitequa1k: and a crystal, plus for anything but a dipole, a balun. that's just like the at86rf231
2011-04-05 17:17 <wpwrak> tuxbrain: could work, yes
2011-04-05 17:17 <wpwrak> whitequa1k: the crystal is almost unavoidable - you need 40 ppm stability
2011-04-05 17:18 <whitequa1k> wpwrak: oh sure, a crystal too, and load capacitors
2011-04-05 17:18 <wpwrak> whitequa1k: someone could design a "parasitic" oscillator that takes another station as its reference, but afaik, nobody has done such a thing yet
2011-04-05 17:19 <wpwrak> whitequa1k: i think the mc1322x may be your best best for low component count. no external xtal load caps, integrated balun. unfortunately, the chip itself is a bit large. but still smaller than a module
2011-04-05 17:20 <whitequa1k> wpwrak: it's not only large, it has pads underneath it. I won't be able to do pcb for it by myself
2011-04-05 17:20 <whitequa1k> so unfortunately I don't think that is an option
2011-04-05 17:21 <whitequa1k> atrfs are nice, but I wasn't able to find any in russia (you can buy a thousand, but not one)
2011-04-05 17:23 <wpwrak> whitequa1k: if you can buy a thousand, someone must have spares :)
2011-04-05 17:24 <wpwrak> whitequa1k: maybe ask atmel ? otherwise, the cc2500 may be a suitable alternative. oddly enough, that one has us export restrictions while the at86rf231 doesn't ;-)
2011-04-05 17:25 <whitequa1k> wpwrak: do you mean, ask them for samples?
2011-04-05 17:28 <whitequa1k> ah well, terraelectronica has some cc2500 in stock. the problem is solved then
2011-04-05 17:34 <whitequa1k> also, are those 'chip antennas' as good as they're described on vendor site?:)
2011-04-05 19:55 <wpwrak> curses blackouts
2011-04-05 19:57 <wpwrak> whitequa1k: (atmel) samples or names of distributors
2011-04-05 19:58 <wpwrak> whitequa1k: (chip antenna) dunno. it's said that their performance varies a lot with their surroundings, so they may need careful tuning