2010-10-21 00:31 [commit] Xiangfu Liu: override dh_auto_clean, use make spotless instread http://qi-hw.com/p/fped/19ffb4d 2010-10-21 00:39 wpwrak: in the PDF you posted earlier, I like the 'plot to go' terminology 2010-10-21 00:40 I think 'plot to go' can equally be applied to the pcb and smt manufacturing steps 2010-10-21 00:40 so in other words it should be possible to automatically generate (plot) from KiCad all files necessary to use for PCB and SMT manufacturing steps 2010-10-21 00:40 plot to go 2010-10-21 00:41 pretty cool term I think 2010-10-21 00:42 heh, you read it in more detail than i did :) 2010-10-21 01:09 kristianpaul: the visitors chart on the qi homepage is back 2010-10-21 01:10 this time as a PNG, so it requires no more flash 2010-10-21 01:10 it's not properly cached on the server yet, so load may be bad (I will fix this sometime later) 2010-10-21 01:10 also, it shows the most conservative number now, unique visitors 2010-10-21 01:11 even for those numbers I suspect a lot of robots and bot activity, but anyway I only want to display the most conservative numbers, not inflated stuff 2010-10-21 02:09 wolfspraul: if you're looking for schematics to track, here's a small one: project f32xbase, c2ben/c2ben.sch 2010-10-21 02:11 [commit] Werner Almesberger: c2ben/c2ben.brd: changed track width from 8 to 10 mil http://qi-hw.com/p/f32xbase/66a929a 2010-10-21 02:12 wpwrak: in eda-tools/boom/boom-config.in, usage() is not called if you pass no parameters at all 2010-10-21 02:16 heh, you ask for nothing thus you get nothing ;-) 2010-10-21 02:18 not a good idea 2010-10-21 02:21 [commit] Werner Almesberger: boom/boom-config.in: complain if invoked without argument (reported by Wolfgang http://qi-hw.com/p/eda-tools/8bf21d8 2010-10-21 02:21 now it's a tad more user-friendly 2010-10-21 02:24 thanks for the heads up, I added c2ben to the automatically tracked schematics 2010-10-21 02:25 thanks ! 2010-10-21 02:27 it's a slightly simplified version of your "street job". a passive board for in-circuit programming of c8051f32x MCUs. (as used in idbg, atusb, and cntr) 2010-10-21 02:30 one of the things often overlooked is how small runs and large runs go hand in hand 2010-10-21 02:31 well, two boards - one that goes into the uSD slot and the other that has the header. with a few cm of cable in between to avoid having a long rigid lever 2010-10-21 02:31 as you know, any attempt to pull off a large run successfully requires supporting 'stuff', fixtures, testing boards, etc. 2010-10-21 02:31 yes, yes .. :) 2010-10-21 02:31 if you have no way of creating those efficiently, that is both quick and cheap, you will never get to a successful large run either 2010-10-21 02:31 well, I don't write it for you, but for our logged archives :-) 2010-10-21 02:31 you know this already of course 2010-10-21 02:31 but many people don't know how these two things connect together 2010-10-21 02:32 they don't sell all the little 'side boards' you need if you want to make 100k of anything 2010-10-21 02:32 and even if you don't look at cash cost, but just at how many days it takes you to make one of these, once you have discovered the need, that can be the make or break decision in your large run 2010-10-21 02:33 typo: I meant "they don't see all the little..." 2010-10-21 02:33 so... 2010-10-21 02:33 the various tools we are fiddling around with here will help us get into a better position to make small runs of small boards possible, cheap and quick 2010-10-21 02:33 and that's the foundation for anything bigger 2010-10-21 02:33 that's why i like to have a fairly high level of independence in my little lab and workshop :) 2010-10-21 02:33 totally 2010-10-21 02:34 small run and large run needs complement each other 2010-10-21 02:34 if you want to get to the ability to do a large run, you first have to make small runs really efficient 2010-10-21 02:34 you need the small run capability for prototypes anyway 2010-10-21 02:34 they are the building blocks of the large runs 2010-10-21 02:34 in my experience you need them all over the place :-) 2010-10-21 02:35 there is always this or that need popping up for a board you only need 10 or 20 of 2010-10-21 02:35 indeed. like test harnesses :) 2010-10-21 02:35 but you desperately need those, otherwise you are screwed 2010-10-21 02:35 maybe it's the hardware equivalents of scripting :-) 2010-10-21 02:36 that's not a bad comparison :) 2010-10-21 02:36 or analogy 2010-10-21 02:38 plus you need mechanical prototyping/one-off capabilities too, not only boards 2010-10-21 02:40 on the mechanical side I need to learn more about the various work steps, tools, and how they connect 2010-10-21 02:40 but of course, I would agree that there are many connections and overlaps there too 2010-10-21 02:40 cnc really helps there. e.g., for all the little micro-SD boards i have now, it would be extremely tedious to cut them manually. with the mill, once i have a good parameter set, i can very quickly make a few boards (how many depends on how many i can cut from a single raw pcb. when i have to change pcbs, a longer adjustment process is needed) 2010-10-21 02:42 you mean the board outline? 2010-10-21 02:42 for one-offs, it's basically materials like wood or anything you can get in easily processable sheets (such as pcbs). then add screws, glue, etc. ;-) 2010-10-21 02:42 yes, that was about board outlines 2010-10-21 02:44 if i need something else that's 2D, the same process applies. well, i should use heekscad for such things too, so that i would get more accurate outlines (my quick and dirty math doesn't get the non-90 deg angles right). it's just an inconvenient detour, so i take the shortcut and live with a few small imperfections. 2010-10-21 02:46 one-offs can also be all manual. depends a bit on what they are. e.g., for some of the 3D scans i need special supports that hold the part well in place but that aren't themselves "seen" by the scanner. 2010-10-21 02:50 many 3D problems can also be reduced to 2D. particularly the laser cutter folks are getting good at that. they have those machines that make incredibly good 2D cuts but are (almost) completely useless when it comes to 3D. so they piece their 3D structures together from 2D elements. 2010-10-21 02:50 there are probably a few interesting tricks to learn from them 2010-10-21 02:56 anyway,getting a nap now. fedex may ring in just a few hours :) 2010-10-21 02:59 wpwrak heh.. tell me 2010-10-21 02:59 ;) 2010-10-21 03:01 wpwrak holler if you need something lasered 2010-10-21 03:03 roh: can you show me the machines/tools you have access to when I visit Berlin around 27c3? 2010-10-21 03:03 wolfspraul sure 2010-10-21 03:04 ok cool, thanks 2010-10-21 03:40 wpwrak: in eda-tools/boom/dist/dk/Makefile, line 40, is the -recursive in rm -rf necessary? Would a plain rm -f be enough? 2010-10-21 03:58 kyak: hmm, yeah. I don't know either. he used to be here more I will ping him. you can email the discussion list, cc mirko.vogt@sharism.cc 2010-10-21 03:58 ok, will do, thanks! 2010-10-21 03:59 (however, i don't like mailing lists very much :) ) 2010-10-21 06:31 wolfspraul: chart is threÂ Â !! 2010-10-21 06:31 thanks !! 2010-10-21 06:31 :) 2010-10-21 06:40 yeah. heise mentioned the ben nanonote support in their 2.6.36 announcement. not on the "front page" but at least it's there. 2010-10-21 06:43 [commit] Werner Almesberger: boom/dist/dk/Makefile: changed rm -rf to rm -f (reported by Wolfgang Spraul) http://qi-hw.com/p/eda-tools/ce1d269 2010-10-21 06:43 wolfspraul: fixed. thanks for spotting ! 2010-10-21 06:44 wpwrak: he :-) [heise] 2010-10-21 06:44 the heise guys are pretty cool, I know two of them now and they are reading what I write to them 2010-10-21 06:45 I'm pretty sure if we would provide a higher quality news stream to them some things would pop up, over time 2010-10-21 06:45 working on it, as you know... 2010-10-21 06:52 good, good :) 2010-10-21 06:53 if you have heise, you have germany :) 2010-10-21 07:00 I honestly think that any German media, as well as all other non-US/UK countries, are not a good starting point for syndication 2010-10-21 07:00 in other words, if you are covered by some relevant US or UK media, all others will pickup the story :-) 2010-10-21 07:00 you can be covered in the largest French, Spanish, German, Polish or what not magazine, and nothing will happen 2010-10-21 07:01 (except for in that country, of course, if you have a strong enough presence there) 2010-10-21 07:05 so I work with German media because I happen to speak the language. just rationally my time would be better spent working with US/UK media. 2010-10-21 07:10 wolfspraul: do you happen to know why "Delete" button (red arrow + BackSpace) is acting as BackSpace on Ben? 2010-10-21 07:12 no, sounds like a bug 2010-10-21 07:12 i rememember it has always been like this 2010-10-21 07:13 i just never really cared 2010-10-21 07:13 need to investigate then :) 2010-10-21 07:16 wolfspraul: (us vs. de) dunno. germany seems to be a very fertile ground for anything open, more so (in proportion) than many other places. also, anything that gets covered in germany reaches the large population there (plus austria and switzerland). remember that germany was about on par with the us as a market for openmoko. so i think your time isn't wasted trying to access that market. 2010-10-21 07:28 what is the kernel on NNs? 2010-10-21 07:29 did you see this improvement http://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/torvalds/linux-2.6.git;a=commitdiff;h=0798cea8c2e1afee59686c51d27d0e96b05e42d1 ? 2010-10-21 07:29 it's on 2.6.36 2010-10-21 07:29 wpwrak: yes but trust me. in most cases, German journalists wait for US/UK news to translate/copy. you can reach them that way better than directly. 2010-10-21 07:33 wolfspraul: ah well, that may be. so, theregister.co.uk next - feed the vulture ? :) 2010-10-21 08:03 xiangfu: I'll move the 2010-09-14 image out of the testing folder now, and point the latest symlink to it 2010-10-21 08:03 also I will delete the other testing images 2010-10-21 08:03 I hope we have a new image soon with more frameworks working :-) (mirko is on it...) 2010-10-21 08:04 but we need to officially release 2010-09-14 because it is also the one that has been reflashed on the latest run of 1k Bens 2010-10-21 08:06 done... from now on people who just innocently run reflash_ben.sh will get 2010-09-14 2010-10-21 08:06 that's a very nice image 2010-10-21 08:12 good you like it, I'm a bit worried about the Qt/SDL problems 2010-10-21 08:13 also we broke binary compatibility (due to 0.9.32), and will probably switch back (!) in the next image 2010-10-21 08:13 but of course, there are many improvements in there, it's just not all perfectly rounded yet 2010-10-21 08:15 i myself never switched to 0.9.32, due to mentioned problems :) 2010-10-21 08:17 he, OK 2010-10-21 08:17 :-) 2010-10-21 08:17 but like I said, now people running reflash_ben.sh will just get it 2010-10-21 08:17 oh well. we will have another, better, image soon I hope 2010-10-21 08:17 but 0.9.30.1 also got it's problems.. like the screen is skrewed after exiting Qt applications 2010-10-21 08:42 tuxbrain: here's the picture you asked me about: http://downloads.qi-hardware.com/people/werner/f32x/c2ben-run1.jpg 2010-10-21 08:43 (still untested if the whole contraption works properly) 2010-10-21 08:48 wolfspraul: it's also an idea for your "street job", in case it turned out ugly. with one pcb on each side, soldering the cable is actually quite easy. 2010-10-21 08:49 now, if fedex would hurry a little, i could make a lead-free version of it as well ... 2010-10-21 09:06 [commit] Werner Almesberger: Prepare abstraction of C2 communication. http://qi-hw.com/p/f32xbase/ab35c6b 2010-10-21 09:06 [commit] Werner Almesberger: Support different targets. (Openmoko GTA01/02 with Dbgv3, soon c2ben.) http://qi-hw.com/p/f32xbase/de75051 2010-10-21 09:06 [commit] Werner Almesberger: Switched from four-spaces to one-tab indentation. http://qi-hw.com/p/f32xbase/3bbf318 2010-10-21 09:26 wpwrak: why only 4 wires? due it's just a test? there should be the 8 of it wired in the final break out board, isn't it? 2010-10-21 09:33 wolfspraul: release release !! 2010-10-21 09:33 :) 2010-10-21 09:35 xiangfu: hello, i just wonder why i must do symbolic link in rc.d to make the start init.d script to work 2010-10-21 09:35 once do it, i have a nice shiny gmenu2x booting at startup 2010-10-21 09:35 that's how rc.d works 2010-10-21 09:36 ok so the simlink is missing in the data/files folder in openwrt it seems 2010-10-21 09:36 tuxbrain: 4 wires because the thing on the other end needs only 4 connections. 2010-10-21 09:39 wpwrak: ok :) , your thing your rules , If I had the tools/knowledge I would had wired the all thing to have a more versatile thing, but I supouse you can do another one if you need it so... wathever I like it a lot :) 2010-10-21 09:39 tuxbrain: also, the arrangement on the other side is GND-VDD-Data-Data, (safe against polarity inversion) so I'd have to somehow rearrange the clock line that's between GND and VDD. thus, an 8-line variant wouldn't be quite generic anyway. better keep it simple :) 2010-10-21 09:39 kristianpaul, thy symbolic should done by openwrt by default. 2010-10-21 09:40 tuxbrain: (make another one) exactly. it's easy and fun ;-) 2010-10-21 09:40 wolfspraul, ok about 2010-09-14 image. 2010-10-21 09:41 xiangfu: if not?.. 2010-10-21 09:41 xiangfu: by default in the build process? 2010-10-21 09:42 kristianpaul yes 2010-10-21 09:42 hm 2010-10-21 09:43 what it could miss 2010-10-21 09:43 i remenber i did the symbolic link fot the files folder. 2010-10-21 09:43 wel.. 2010-10-21 09:45 tuxbrain: btw, how is the sdio-to-serial board coming along ? did you have any time for it ? 2010-10-21 09:45 wpwrak: just for curiosity, what are the software/hardwrare tools you have used to do this? I would love to see a video of the whole proccess, with that simple thing as example. 2010-10-21 09:46 wpwrak: this saturday I go to a hack meeting in Zgz, after the speach at morning, I have reserved the whole day to hack on spi 2010-10-21 09:46 I hope I can return with some results 2010-10-21 09:46 I have more or less completed my work on the 11/1 community news, trying to collect what I could find 2010-10-21 09:46 http://en.qi-hardware.com/wiki/Community_news_2010-11-01 2010-10-21 09:47 if anybody has corrections, additions, etc. - edit away... 2010-10-21 09:47 I will spend the next few days trying to spread our newsfeed URL a bit more 2010-10-21 09:47 http://en.qi-hardware.com/feed/rss20.xml 2010-10-21 09:47 tuxbrain: (tools) kicad and my CAM scripts at http://svn.openmoko.org/developers/werner/cncmap/ 2010-10-21 09:47 tuxbrain: the project itself is here: http://projects.qi-hardware.com/index.php/p/f32xbase/source/tree/master/c2ben/ 2010-10-21 09:48 xiangfu: tuxbrain : can you announce/push that feed url on your blogs? 2010-10-21 09:48 we need to get a few more people to add it to their feeds, otherwise we have great news but no readers :-) 2010-10-21 09:49 of course anybody else here who has a blog can help too 2010-10-21 09:49 tuxbrain: i cut the boards with my CNC mill (the one that also does the scans). i used toner transfer to copy the layout on the board and then etched it with 2 H2Os + HCl. 2010-10-21 09:49 05:48 tuxbrain: i cut the boards with my CNC mill (the one that also does the scans). i used toner transfer to copy the layout on the board and then etched it with 2 H2Os + HCl. 2010-10-21 09:50 the cnc was a profesional one or DIY 2010-10-21 09:50 sorry. wrong "ENTER" 2010-10-21 09:50 tuxbrain: for the cable, i used one of these cable peeling machines, to get a straight cut. (i normally use a pincer-like tool, but that one does only one cable at a time) lemme see if i can find a picture ... 2010-10-21 09:50 workspace , yes sure. 2010-10-21 09:51 tuxbrain: (cnc) it's my roland mdx-15. comes ready to use out of the box. 2010-10-21 09:52 tuxbrain: diy may be cheaper and more flexible, though. 2010-10-21 09:52 wpwrak: the thing is make it accurate :) 2010-10-21 09:54 as long term project we are triying to equip us with tools to achive make our own prototipe pcbs 2010-10-21 09:55 tuxbrain: here's such a wire stripper: http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&name=PA1115P-ND 2010-10-21 09:56 tuxbrain: looks nicer than mine, though. mine's something like 20 years old :) 2010-10-21 09:57 we are near to finishing our insolator http://www.tuxbrain.com/projects/insoladora/insoladora.zip 2010-10-21 09:57 tuxbrain: then i superglued the cable on the board, let it dry a bit, and then soldered the contacts. the glue holds everything nicely in place, so the soldering is easy. you don't even need to tin the cables first. i did pre-tin the board, though. i now always do this, because it also protects the traces from corrosion. 2010-10-21 09:58 what are you guys doing? (sounds really interesting) 2010-10-21 09:58 wpwrak: interesting... how is done the procces of pre-tin? 2010-10-21 09:59 tuxbrain: last but not least, i taped the boards down with painter's tape and put a bit of silicone on the cable and non-contact areas. shaped it manually (put a bit of alcohol on the finger and it won't stick) 2010-10-21 09:59 after this, we will go to the cnc 2010-10-21 10:00 kristianpaul: it's just a little pair of boards for in-circuit programming of c8051f32x chips, connected to the ben's uSD port 2010-10-21 10:00 oh ok 2010-10-21 10:00 tuxbrain: I think you should read this http://csolaviejaescuela.blogspot.com/ 2010-10-21 10:01 wpwrak: nice finishing point , :) 2010-10-21 10:02 tuxbrain: (have in-house prototyping facilities) yes, that's a very good idea :) you're so much more in control of things if you don't need to outsource every little task. and you save time as well. 2010-10-21 10:03 tuxbrain: (tinning) just apply flux to the whole board, put a bit of tin on a large pad, and "paint" it with the soldering iron over the entire board. 2010-10-21 10:03 jluis: yeah I know, I have call them this morning , hehehe we don't need to make arrested to go to prison... we go there voluntaring :) 2010-10-21 10:03 tuxbrain: if course, it helps if your boards are small (which mine generally are ;-) 2010-10-21 10:04 mmm this is after the acid treatment isn't it? 2010-10-21 10:05 tuxbrain: for the flux, i'd recommend water-soluble. it's the easiest to get rid of. RA flux is a sticky nightmare. no-clean flux is more difficult to wash off than water soluble. you could of course leave no-clean on the board, but your board will look messy and the flux is also a weak conductor, so there could be surprises. 2010-10-21 10:05 http://www.funcubedongle.com/ 2010-10-21 10:05 tuxbrain: yes, tinning is after the etching 2010-10-21 10:07 lekernel: what is the fun cube satellite? and what it does? 2010-10-21 10:07 it's for AMSAT (amateur radio satellites) 2010-10-21 10:07 check out that keyword 2010-10-21 10:08 they've been operating since a few years after Sputnik, which is a lot more impressive to me that this OSSI (that "DIY/arduino/designer" satellite) crap 2010-10-21 10:08 lekernel: nice board ! haven't gotten myself to work with stencils yet. 2010-10-21 10:09 dunno if you've seen OSSI... it's just one more of those crappy arduinesque things 2010-10-21 10:10 it has some buzz which is simply ridiculous, amateur radios have been _doing_ their "revolution" for decades already 2010-10-21 10:10 wow, DIY satellites, I don't know this thing even exist :), and they say they are near to launch one soon! 2010-10-21 10:11 they already launched a lot 2010-10-21 10:11 lekernel: wow nice blog! I'll add it to our planet... do you know the license of their work? 2010-10-21 10:12 mmmm how? from where? who? for what? wow 2010-10-21 10:12 only they _do_ things and don't talk much, so they are drown in the twitteresque/arduinesque noise 2010-10-21 10:12 hamradios do a lot of interesting stuff 2010-10-21 10:13 it's much better than the DIY yuppies 2010-10-21 10:13 lekernel: common don't be so hard of with the EE wannabies like me :P 2010-10-21 10:14 lekernel and arduino will feature in La Haine II ;-) 2010-10-21 10:15 lekernel: if you know more such blogs please let me know I am very interested in collecting them in our planet 2010-10-21 10:15 wolfspraul: that's the spirit ! "_our_ planet" ! world domination ! ;-) 2010-10-21 10:17 lekernel: I agree in dismmiss all those that prettend to sell arduino as the definitive solution for electronics , but I compare it to duct tape, usefull to do patches and quick prototiping , but not for a pro use, 2010-10-21 10:18 it's merely an AVR, which is perfectly suitable for professional use 2010-10-21 10:18 definitive solution for electronics :-) that hurts even me... 2010-10-21 10:18 yes it's an AVR breakout board 2010-10-21 10:18 hey they exist, I have talked to them 2010-10-21 10:19 In every places are fanboys 2010-10-21 10:19 lekernel: do you know the license of the funcube stuff? I googled a bit but can't find anything 2010-10-21 10:19 just lazy to search more if you already know it :-) 2010-10-21 10:19 can't find it either 2010-10-21 10:19 and bigger is the community more tendency to that conduct in his users is. 2010-10-21 10:20 hamradios aren't usually open source fanatics either, though most of what they do often respects the same principles 2010-10-21 10:22 btw wolfgang great news recopilationÂ Â , all toghether look preety good (now in right channel) 2010-10-21 10:23 [commit] Xiangfu Liu: add ghostscript to Build-Depends http://qi-hw.com/p/fped/708230f 2010-10-21 10:26 tuxbrain: thanks, quite a bit of work but I'm happy now 2010-10-21 10:26 this also serves as our own reference later 2010-10-21 10:27 the news are now showing on the qi homepage, they are in the rss/atom feed, they can be edited by anyone and published by all wiki admins, etc. 2010-10-21 10:27 so now I can go promote the feed URL, talk to journalists 2010-10-21 10:27 indeed :) 2010-10-21 10:30 wolfspraul: are the 1000 still waiting in the warehouse or have you already shipped some ? 2010-10-21 10:30 december release also looks promising 2010-10-21 10:30 hmm don't know 2010-10-21 10:30 he :-) 2010-10-21 10:30 maybe we have started to slowly sell into those 1000 2010-10-21 10:31 I have a 50 slice of that pie pending to order soon 2010-10-21 10:31 tuxbrain has an order of 50 but he's a bit slow :-) 2010-10-21 10:31 common :) 2010-10-21 10:31 ok ok 2010-10-21 10:31 my beloved customer has exactly the right speed 2010-10-21 10:31 thats better :) 2010-10-21 10:31 but yes, I sorry you know that bank stuff is killing me 2010-10-21 10:32 step by step 2010-10-21 10:32 I am trying to switch my payment gateway to a (hopefully) better one, and I'm literally 4 months into the paperwork now 2010-10-21 10:33 in the end we all believe we are building a business infrastructure that helps us in the future... hopefully... 2010-10-21 10:33 Today I have the sign of contracts and oh! suprise a mistake in numbers!!! coool on week delay again :( 2010-10-21 10:33 tuxbrain: (insoladora) wow. but what does it do ? :) 2010-10-21 10:33 sure, I can imagine 2010-10-21 10:34 hehehe insolate? 2010-10-21 10:34 those are UV leds 2010-10-21 10:35 lekernel: I added the FUNcube feed to the qi planet http://en.qi-hardware.com/planet/ 2010-10-21 10:35 I think it fits very well thanks a lot for the link. if you have more stuff like this please post it... 2010-10-21 10:36 wolfspraul: typo at the very end s/fedore/Fedora/ 2010-10-21 10:36 I hope these guys don't mind syndication, it's pretty standard accepted for such blogs nowadays but who knows, if you say they are not that much into free maybe. 2010-10-21 10:36 well if they don't like it I'll remove the feed of course 2010-10-21 10:37 tuxbrain: yes, but what are they for ? do you need a tan ? ;-) for making pcbs, toner transfer i much simpler 2010-10-21 10:37 s/ i / is / 2010-10-21 10:37 wolfspraul: no don't do it, they can be the perfect excuse to start our sue saga :P 2010-10-21 10:38 wpwrak: thanks, fixed [fedore] 2010-10-21 10:38 I think the FEL people write 'fedora' lowercase btw 2010-10-21 10:38 wolfspraul: (news) how about a box with links to the main sections, like on wikis ? 2010-10-21 10:38 I removed the toc, should I add it back? 2010-10-21 10:38 check it now 2010-10-21 10:39 (fedora) ah, indeed. so is it fEL then ? :) 2010-10-21 10:39 wpwrak: well I don't know wat pcb you use but here the more comon and cheap are the ones fotosensible , you use tonner transfeer or transparence sheets , irradiate for a while and then acid treatement.... 2010-10-21 10:39 a toc seems nice. gives one a bit an idea what to expect. also helps if you want to look up something later. 2010-10-21 10:39 toc added back in 2010-10-21 10:40 I think I will remove the 'plans for the future' section 2010-10-21 10:40 tuxbrain: hmm, toner transfer works like this: you print with a laser printer on plastified paper, the kind you use for photo prints with ink printers. 2010-10-21 10:40 I was excited about boom at the time, but the news is already overloaded. 2010-10-21 10:40 once boom is ready, it's time to show up in the news 2010-10-21 10:41 gone. if someone wants it back, or add their own world domination plans, go ahead revert the change. 2010-10-21 10:41 tuxbrain: when you iron the toner directly on the PCB (or, if you're lazy like me, you use a "plastificadora" .. hmm, what's this in english ... 2010-10-21 10:42 ... a laminator). then wash it a bit to get rid of the goo that may come from the paper and off in the acid with it. no need for UV or photo development. 2010-10-21 10:43 tuxbrain: this process if good enough even for fairly small things. IDBG, ben-wpan, etc. 2010-10-21 10:43 we are even lazyer, we will just put the piece of sheet in a cristal, put the pcb on top and push the button :) 2010-10-21 10:44 wolfspraul: (boom deferred) yeah, no rush with that :) 2010-10-21 10:44 I must leave 2010-10-21 10:44 tuxbrain: ah well, whatever works :) 2010-10-21 10:44 see you later :) 2010-10-21 10:48 (mm1 measurements) nice work ! and nice scope :) 2010-10-21 10:51 wolfspraul: news look pretty good. the pictures sometimes disrupt the flow a bit, but i wouldn't know how to make this better either. 2010-10-21 10:52 tuxbrain_away: this is almost exactly what my cheap and ancient wire stripper looks like. nice to see that they still make them: http://articulo.mercadolibre.com.ar/MLA-96532119-pelacables-automatico-con-cortador-de-cables-power-_JM 2010-10-21 10:53 hmm 2010-10-21 10:53 good point about disruption 2010-10-21 10:53 I think strong pictures will always do that though. 2010-10-21 10:54 one problem is the big scope of the news, so you have to slow down your mind if you want to actually understand what is written. 2010-10-21 10:54 well if anybody wants to edit the news for readability, just go ahead 2010-10-21 10:54 there are enough facts there at least, I did that homework collecting facts and URLs 2010-10-21 10:54 and some generally usable pics and videos I think 2010-10-21 10:56 I won't do many edits anymore, I had enough :-) will spend the next few days promoting the feed URL instead, so hopefully when it's released (and for future news), we have more readers 2010-10-21 10:59 wolfspraul: (pics) it's not so much about the content but about the visual structure. e.g., the RSS newsfeed item after the bootscreen is very easy to overlook 2010-10-21 11:00 wolfspraul: and the schhist screenshot almost hides the text above it :) 2010-10-21 11:02 wolfspraul: maybe putting the 1000 NNs first and schhist last would help. that way, the first picture isn't so huge and there would be nothing directly after the huge schhist screenshot 2010-10-21 11:04 wolfspraul: another possibility would be to shrink the schdiff picture and link to a larger version, but that would make it inconvenient to access. for getting an idea of what it is about, your reduced screenshot has just the right size. 2010-10-21 11:05 wpwrak: how about now? :-) 2010-10-21 11:06 oh sure that screenshot is already heavily 'massaged' 2010-10-21 11:07 I cut rows and columns at will just to get the impression across in around 1000px width 2010-10-21 11:07 (massaged) i didn't think it was easy ;-) 2010-10-21 11:07 I have the rss thing at the top now in italics 2010-10-21 11:08 hmm, the RSS thingy is still easy to overlook. it's an area where wikipedia normally puts meta-information "(redirected from furble)" and such 2010-10-21 11:08 but at least it's not lost in space anymore :) 2010-10-21 11:09 (overlook) well, perhaps that's just me :) 2010-10-21 11:29 wpwrak: have you ever seen manufacturer or distributor part numbers being case sensitive? or using characters outside of a-z, 0-9, '-', what else? 2010-10-21 11:30 does boom make any assumptions about it? I think spaces have to be enclosed in quotes, but are otherwise supported? 2010-10-21 11:30 how about case sensitivity? 2010-10-21 11:31 part numbers very often are just upper case. but some do have weird characters 2010-10-21 11:31 hello? anyone here? 2010-10-21 11:31 lemme find one great example ... 2010-10-21 11:32 http://media.digikey.com/pdf/PCNs/Stackpole/Global Part Number Change.pdf 2010-10-21 11:33 arquebus: yes you are not alone. how can we help? 2010-10-21 11:34 wolfspraul: boom only cares about whitespace. whatever you do between whitespace is your business. there's currently no way to escape whitespace. 2010-10-21 11:35 .mx is malaysia? maldives? :-) 2010-10-21 11:35 wpwrak: "computer unfriendly characters" :-) 2010-10-21 11:35 how about case sensitivity? 2010-10-21 11:35 wolfspraul: BOOM is more or less case sensitive. field names should be case-insensitive, but there may be holes in that. 2010-10-21 11:36 yes that's why I'm asking :-) 2010-10-21 11:36 I read it there and it made me wonder... 2010-10-21 11:36 so part numbers are case sensitive? 2010-10-21 11:36 they should be, yes 2010-10-21 11:36 and the gen/chr processing is case sensitive? 2010-10-21 11:36 except for field names, yes 2010-10-21 11:36 basically you are not upper- or lower-casing strings anywhere, except somewhere in fields processing 2010-10-21 11:37 ok got it 2010-10-21 11:37 that's it, yes :) 2010-10-21 11:37 so that means since most part numbers seem to be written upper-case, we must do that too 2010-10-21 11:37 let's hope that the other 'computer systems' are case sensitive too 2010-10-21 11:37 not sure if it really makes sense to be case-insentitive in field names. maybe not. more consistent. 2010-10-21 11:37 I can definitely imagine many ERP systems just upper-casing a-z 2010-10-21 11:38 one problem with fields is that you can easily get silent failures on a typo. 2010-10-21 11:38 I doubt people have learned that lesson. 2010-10-21 11:38 if everyone used upper case and the ERPs upper-case input, then all is fine :) 2010-10-21 11:39 do you remember having seen any lower-case part numbers? 2010-10-21 11:39 now, i have no idea what happens if you try UTF8 characters :) 2010-10-21 11:39 can't recall any at the moment 2010-10-21 11:39 ok 2010-10-21 11:39 will keep an eye for it 2010-10-21 11:39 there must be some pervers somewhere who did that, though ;-) 2010-10-21 15:01 toys ! :) 2010-10-21 16:27 aisa: greetz 2010-10-21 16:27 howdy! 2010-10-21 16:27 [commit] Juan64Bits: Routing VCCO2 source. http://qi-hw.com/p/xue/a7d01af 2010-10-21 16:28 aisa: What's new? 2010-10-21 16:29 did you hear I crashed my bike? 2010-10-21 16:29 My injury is a week and a couple days old, 2010-10-21 16:29 I have a couple broken bones, cracked teeth, stiches. 2010-10-21 16:29 I'm on the mend, but lower energy than usual, 2010-10-21 16:29 and having to cut back on stuff I'm working on. 2010-10-21 16:29 My e-mail backlog is still frightful. 2010-10-21 16:29 Yes, you did tell me the other day. I was curious about your recovery. 2010-10-21 16:29 Ook. I bet. 2010-10-21 16:31 Did you wipe out or get hit? 2010-10-21 16:35 wpwrak: toys? 2010-10-21 16:36 qbject: I wiped out, best as I can tell.Â Â I don't have memory of the crash, but there was no indication I was hit. 2010-10-21 16:42 qbject: a shipment of electronic components 2010-10-21 16:48 aisa: Wow. Really glad to know you're mending, albeit slowly. 2010-10-21 16:48 wpwrak: Cool! 2010-10-21 16:52 any link to an nanonote default config? 2010-10-21 16:54 larsc, alive? 2010-10-21 16:55 B_Lizzard: yes 2010-10-21 16:56 Hi, 2.6.36 is out, how do I get a defconfig up and running? 2010-10-21 16:56 Um, meaning, where do I get a defconfig for 2.6.36? 2010-10-21 16:56 use the one from the projects.qi-hardware.com kernel repo 2010-10-21 16:57 it should work 2010-10-21 16:58 This: http://projects.qi-hardware.com/index.php/p/qi-kernel/source/tree/master/.config ? 2010-10-21 17:00 hm 2010-10-21 17:00 no 2010-10-21 17:00 i'll commit one 2010-10-21 17:00 Ah, OK 2010-10-21 17:00 There's no .config in the 2.6.36 branch 2010-10-21 17:26 tuxbrain: ah, did i mention that the small atmels (the kind that would be ideal for the serial board) are a little difficult to source ? digi-key only have the atmega48 in an 28qfn package. 2010-10-21 17:34 wpwrak: that thing on Atmel's site about license termination is pretty spooky. think that means that the could pull the plug on one of their binary blob libraries and you'd have to comply? 2010-10-21 17:36 qbject: huh, url ? 2010-10-21 17:36 http://www.atmel.com/general/legal_information.asp 2010-10-21 17:36 (from you and wolfie talking in here on 9-1) 2010-10-21 17:38 qbject: well, i don't think we use any binary blob libraries. they could ask us to destroy all data sheets, though. not sure if this would have any legal standing, though. 2010-10-21 17:39 wpwrak: I was all excited to make a QTouch/AVR keyboard on a nice heavy piece of FR4. I am less excited about it now. 2010-10-21 17:40 Because the QTouch lib is a blob based on a patent they acquired. 2010-10-21 17:40 qbject: what does happen from time to time is that a company stops distributing previously publicly available material. but i've never heard of one asking their customers to destroy the documentation they already obtained. 2010-10-21 17:41 qbject: just say "no" to closed-source software :) 2010-10-21 17:42 wpwrak: Oh, I do. I do. Did you hear that Fruity Computers from Cupertino will now have their own horrible censored app store? 2010-10-21 17:43 qbject: hmm ? did they ever have one that wasn't censored ? :) 2010-10-21 17:43 whee, mirko, back from the dead ! :) 2010-10-21 17:44 wpwrak: No, they didn't, but I mean they're setting one up for the desktops and laptops themselves, not just embedded devices. 2010-10-21 17:44 throws up just thinking about it. 2010-10-21 17:44 qbject: well, never change a winning team, eh ? ;-) 2010-10-21 17:44 I used to be one of those fanboys. I was gonna build a hackintosh but found it easier to install CrunchBang Linux, and it was all downhill from there. 2010-10-21 17:45 qbject: as long as there are enough gullible who buy their stuff ... 2010-10-21 17:46 wpwrak: I guess not. I've just gotta wonder if this is how ol' Stevie wanted it all along. "Free people from their preconceptions so that we can imprision them in a whole new set of preconceptions that benefit US." 2010-10-21 17:46 qbject: (go to linux) good move ! ;-) 2010-10-21 17:47 wpwrak: It'll be even better when they finish the move from Ubuntu repos to pure Debian. 2010-10-21 17:47 qbject: i've heard that he's a control freak. so, obviously, anybody else's control bothers him :) 2010-10-21 17:48 hi 2010-10-21 17:48 Hi jcom 2010-10-21 17:48 I've found a bug in the latest testing image of the ben nanonote 2010-10-21 17:48 does anybody now where should I report it? 2010-10-21 17:52 [commit] Lars-Peter Clausen: Add jz4740 udc driver http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/e575683 2010-10-21 17:52 [commit] Lars-Peter Clausen: Add ili8960 lcd driver http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/a74358d 2010-10-21 17:52 [commit] Lars-Peter Clausen: li http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/f8359db 2010-10-21 17:52 [commit] Lars-Peter Clausen: Add gpio chager driver http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/016d98c 2010-10-21 17:52 [commit] Lars-Peter Clausen: MIPS: JZ4740: qi_lb60: Add gpio-charger device http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/22f28f7 2010-10-21 17:52 [commit] Lars-Peter Clausen: Add n516 board support http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/3c4c223 2010-10-21 17:52 [commit] Lars-Peter Clausen: n516 http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/0632d29 2010-10-21 17:52 [commit] Lars-Peter Clausen: Add n526 board support http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/f40825a 2010-10-21 17:52 [commit] Lars-Peter Clausen: n526 http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/08db3d4 2010-10-21 17:52 [commit] Lars-Peter Clausen: Add N516 sound SoC board driver http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/ccfcd16 2010-10-21 17:52 [commit] Lars-Peter Clausen: Add N526 sound SoC board driver http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/a70e08a 2010-10-21 17:52 [commit] Lars-Peter Clausen: i2c: Add i2c driver for JZ47XX SoCs http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/4057d1c 2010-10-21 17:52