2010-09-12 00:29 xiangfu: strange, every time I run scripts/feeds install -a, it installs a few more packages 2010-09-12 00:30 I can run it 3, 4 times, and every time a few more get installed :-) 2010-09-12 00:30 wolfspraul: yes. there are new packages commit. 2010-09-12 00:30 no no 2010-09-12 00:30 it looks like a problem of the scripts, or some other cause like dates or so 2010-09-12 00:31 I make no changes at all. Just start with a git clone, the scripts/feeds update -a, then scripts/feeds install -a 2010-09-12 00:31 but 'install -a' will not install all package, only some 2010-09-12 00:31 and more will come down every time I run 'install -a' again 2010-09-12 00:32 not just from the qipackages feed, all feeds behave like that. I have tried on the tracking_trunk branch too, same behavior 2010-09-12 00:33 maybe when going through the packages in a feed, something will make OpenWrt stop, and go to the next feed 2010-09-12 00:33 then next time I run 'install -a' it will continue? 2010-09-12 00:34 wolfspraul:Â Â I am not sure. 2010-09-12 00:34 wolfspraul: there must some wrong with you feeds/ folder. I guess. 2010-09-12 00:34 no the feeds/ folder is complete 2010-09-12 00:34 the 'update -a' worked 2010-09-12 00:35 but 'install -a' will only install them in batches, I keep running 'install -a' now and every time a few more pacakges get installed :-) 2010-09-12 00:35 when you run 'install -a' next time, try to run it again, see whether more is installed... 2010-09-12 00:35 don't trust it to run only once 2010-09-12 00:36 wolfspraul: just run five times, here is the output: 2010-09-12 00:36 wolfspraul: http://pastebin.com/9usabzMP 2010-09-12 00:37 no new package installed. 2010-09-12 00:37 good for you :-) 2010-09-12 00:37 I ran about 10 times, then all packages were installed, now it's done and seems stable (nothing more to install). 2010-09-12 00:39 xiangfu: http://pastebin.com/eqkApukQ 2010-09-12 00:41 until I understand the root cause, I will always run 'install -a' several times until it runs without installins new packages 2010-09-12 00:46 wolfspraul: I am looking into the ./scripts/feeds file. 2010-09-12 00:49 experimenting more. it may have something to do with dependencies. 2010-09-12 00:50 try this: scripts/feeds uninstall -a -p xfce 2010-09-12 00:50 then scripts/feeds install -a -p xfce 2010-09-12 00:50 then another scripts/feeds install -a -p xfce 2010-09-12 00:51 in my case, the first install -a will not install all packages from xfce, the second, third, fourth, etc. will install more 2010-09-12 00:52 I need about 9 times, then they are all installed. always in the same order/sequence. 2010-09-12 00:53 wolfspraul: the first line give an error: Unknown option: p 2010-09-12 00:55 wolfspraul: seems works fine here. : http://pastebin.com/aFasWdf6 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] jow: [package] base-files: add an experimental "-c" flag which tries to preserve *all* changed files in /overlay/etc minus some system files http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/feaf88f 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] jow: [imagebuilder] http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/67f09fa 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] jow: [imagebuilder] fix arch detection pattern to cope with underscores in board name, e.g. "adm5120_mips" http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/cbcb7e2 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] jow: [package] util-linux-ng: make build depend on libncurses, cfdisk is compiled unconditionally and will fail with missing input files if ncurses was not detected during configure http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/ba59625 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] mb: iproute2: Fix compilation http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/9d4993c 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] jow: [package] uhttpd: break tight loop when receiving eof during header reading (#7904) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/8c59fdd 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] jow: [include] pass opkg offline root as command line arg, solves caching issues when switching between multiple subtargets, thanks Ralph Hempel for reporting http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/5e3ed67 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] mb: iproute2: Once the make calls were fixed up, parallel compile seems to work well. http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/177f4b1 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] jow: [imagebuilder] fix a small typo in sed pattern http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/12bb9fe 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] mb: Allow receiving input events even if the X-server grabbed the device. http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/4aff853 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] mb: Refresh patch http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/2617211 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] florian: [package] fix acx-mac80211 build failure with latest compat-wireless http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/eba6ff5 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] florian: [package] update acx-mac80211 to 20100830 http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/60b11dc 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] mb: omap24xx: Add pointercal file http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/1d74d1e 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] mb: omap24xx: Add default network config http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/53687e5 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] florian: [package] nvvram: no checksum error recording on WRT54G3GV2(-VF) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/edc292c 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] florian: [buildroot] ccache TARGET_CXX http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/691fd24 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] jow: [package] 6in4: don't use abbreviated notation for 0.0.0.0/0, iproute apparently does not like it anymore http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/7b3bd12 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] jow: [package] firewall: http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/c653713 2010-09-12 01:03 [commit] mb: Fix kernel crypto modules for >= 2.6.36 http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/8eeeaa5 2010-09-12 02:48 DocScrutinizer: another question: the thickness of my board differs indeed from that of ti's reference design that uses the same antenna. i have 0.8 mm, they have 1 mm. 2010-09-12 02:48 DocScrutinizer: the application note says "To compensate for a thicker/thinner PCB the antenna could be made slightly shorter/longer." 2010-09-12 02:51 DocScrutinizer: any idea how to interpret this ? since my board is 20% thinner, should I make my antenna 20% longer ? or maybe 10% ? also, which of the lengths would expand - only L2 ? L2 and L5 ? also L3 ? etc. 2010-09-12 02:52 DocScrutinizer: lengths from page 4 of http://focus.ti.com/lit/an/swra117d/swra117d.pdf 2010-09-12 03:01 DocScrutinizer i suppose i could somehow measure the antenna performance with my usrp2. things like reflection. hmm ... 2010-09-12 03:11 here's some guy who did characterize an antenna with an usrp: http://swigerco.com/gnuradio/phase/isotron.html 2010-09-12 05:01 [commit] kyak: kbd: added kbd console maps http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/b754438 2010-09-12 05:08 kyak: do you know whether we include cyrillic fonts now? 2010-09-12 05:20 so, does anyone know why i can't build gforth yet? 2010-09-12 05:20 I'm working my way through the build system, but not there yet... 2010-09-12 05:29 wolfspraul: we do, i can read and type cyrillic in console (UTF-8).. with certain limitations right now - those keymaps still need to be adapted to Ben's keyboard layout 2010-09-12 05:36 kyak: are they included in our normal OpenWrt builds? 2010-09-12 05:36 (the cyrillic fonts) 2010-09-12 05:38 there is a new package kbd-console-maps including many standard Linux console fonts 2010-09-12 05:38 if it is included on a next build, then we would have it 2010-09-12 05:38 ah ok, cool 2010-09-12 05:39 oh, no.. not exactly like this 2010-09-12 05:40 there is a "kbd" package, that provides tools for setting console fonts and manupulating keymap switching 2010-09-12 05:40 the kbd-console-fonts package includes the fonts 2010-09-12 05:40 the kbd-console-maps package includes those keymaps 2010-09-12 05:43 there are several problems: 1) the fonts provided with kbd are too big; 2) keymaps are only partial usable and 3) some user-space programs still don't work correcly in such console 2010-09-12 05:44 for example, sdcv (console version of stardict) is showing cyrillic correctly, but it doesn't accept cyrillic input 2010-09-12 05:45 ok, but as a first step we should still include those 3 packages in the image? 2010-09-12 05:45 i'd like to map the "Ben" key for layout switch instead of "Ctrl" :) 2010-09-12 05:45 wolfspraul: yes, they can be included (in fact, kbd and kbd-console-fonts were already included i think) 2010-09-12 06:56 wpwrak: moinmoin 2010-09-12 06:56 wpwrak: wasn't there some pointer to details about "longer/shorter" in appnotes of the whole device? 2010-09-12 08:49 DocScrutinizer: good morning :)Â Â i found only the sentence i quoted 2010-09-12 08:50 DocScrutinizer: but nothing specific. what i'm loooking for is at least an educated guess for how much i should add 2010-09-12 08:51 I'm sure I've read "for details see application notes of WX5836-4711foobar" OWTTE 2010-09-12 08:53 yes, but that are the details of the reference design board. so there you find out that it's 1.0 mm. an043 doesn't tell you even that. 2010-09-12 09:00 btw: http://www.google.com/webhp?#q=swr-meter+selbstbau 2010-09-12 09:02 oh, nice. thanks ! 2010-09-12 09:29 (swr) meter. hmm, they need a lot of power. but i'm beginning to get the concept 2010-09-12 09:37 DocScrutinizer: so ... any suggesting for a first try antenna resizing for the 1 mm to 0.8 mm change ? 2010-09-12 09:42 I'd not care and simply go for the "tunig mod" I suggested (the L shaped end at 'top' of antenna) 2010-09-12 09:43 this "increase/reduce length" is rubbish, nobody gets the real meaning 2010-09-12 09:44 also it unclear to me how exactly PCB thickness influences ant tuning at all 2010-09-12 09:45 okay, so i'll just add a little "tail" 2010-09-12 09:45 however I can see huge impact of even plastic case covering antenna area - of course nothing metal must cover antenna area either side 2010-09-12 09:47 the "description" of the changes necessary is indeed rather vague. ti tend to be obscure about these things in general, it seems. it's also quite a bit of work to find out how to do a balun, assuming you don't want their "just copy the gerbers with all the microstrip inductors" design 2010-09-12 09:47 :nod: 2010-09-12 09:48 the effect of plastic sucks a bit indeed. i think this will be fun. hence my idea to build my own SWR meter, so that I can at least see where things go wrong. 2010-09-12 09:49 In TPE legendary bookstore I bought a nice book about antenae only ~600+ pp. Gave it to Tully, maybe should have sent to you instead :-D 2010-09-12 09:50 heh, i miss that bookstore 2010-09-12 09:50 me too 2010-09-12 09:51 never thought I'd say that but actually I miss whole TPE experience every once in a while :-D 2010-09-12 09:51 modulo the flights 2010-09-12 09:52 there had been good times amidst the bad ones, yes. 2010-09-12 09:52 yeah actually 2010-09-12 09:52 i find it fascinating how often germans complain about little flights of 12 hours or such :) 2010-09-12 09:53 I bet tampere FI couldn't compete, if ever that'd become an option for me 2010-09-12 09:54 only since they forbid smoking 2010-09-12 09:56 flight to New Orleans 1985 was nice. Smokers, whole row for me so I could stretch over 3 seats... 2010-09-12 09:57 i once had a flight geneva-jfk the week after 9/11. that was nice. almost empty ;-) 2010-09-12 09:57 hehe 2010-09-12 09:57 A[A[A[A[A[A[A[A 2010-09-12 09:57 [A[A[A[A[A[A[A[A[A[A 2010-09-12 09:57 d :w 2010-09-12 09:57 uhuh 2010-09-12 09:57 (sorry) 2010-09-12 09:58 lol 2010-09-12 09:58 hi wolfgang 2010-09-12 09:58 hi 2010-09-12 09:59 DocScrutinizer: I think I may have seen that book at Adam's place. Tully gave it to Adam. 2010-09-12 09:59 :-D 2010-09-12 10:01 wolfspraul: any idea if om.com postmaster could be prodded to forward my .com email address? 2010-09-12 10:03 or at least implemet an autoresponder telling about the address should be .org now 2010-09-12 10:03 I massively doubt this will ever happen. 2010-09-12 10:03 as well :-D 2010-09-12 10:03 meh 2010-09-12 10:36 DocScrutinizer: here's an interesting SWR meter: http://ludens.cl/Electron/swr/swr.html 2010-09-12 10:37 Hello 2010-09-12 10:37 Anyone with a Neo Freerunner? 2010-09-12 10:43 viric: just shoot your FreeRunner question... 2010-09-12 10:44 ah 2010-09-12 10:44 I'm about to buy one 2010-09-12 10:44 I wanted to know if there is anything bad I should know... 2010-09-12 10:44 can it properly receive/make calls, receive/send sms? 2010-09-12 10:45 are you serious? 2010-09-12 10:45 hm 2010-09-12 10:45 I heard it had troubles 2010-09-12 10:45 I heard little about it, and I heard little good... 2010-09-12 10:45 Maybe those telling me that were iphone fans, I don't know 2010-09-12 10:45 I'm reading http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_FreeRunner_Hardware_Issues 2010-09-12 10:46 do you want to have a phone you can use as a normal daily phone? 2010-09-12 10:46 yes 2010-09-12 10:46 wolfspraul: rafa seems to be quite happy with his as a daily phone:) 2010-09-12 10:46 DocScrutinizer: a little tail like this ? http://downloads.qi-hardware.com/people/werner/wpan/antenna-with-tail.ps 2010-09-12 10:47 I thought your "are you serious?" was more about "of course it works". But maybe you mean "of course it still does not work" ? 2010-09-12 10:47 viric: ah no, that's just because I was laughing since yes, there are people in this channel who know an awful lot about FreeRunners... :-) 2010-09-12 10:48 viric: maybe he as referring to the fact that openmoko stopped making phones more than a year ago ... 2010-09-12 10:48 long story short, if you are a real true hardcore free software lover, go buy your FreeRunner and (most likely) start the suffering 2010-09-12 10:48 viric: ... and of course, you find a surprisingly large number of ex-openmokoers around here :) 2010-09-12 10:48 Hm 2010-09-12 10:49 out of 100 people, I think maybe 2 or 3 successfully continue to use their FreeRunners as a daily phone after let's say 1 week 2010-09-12 10:49 most use it as a GPS device, tangopos was by far the most successful application 2010-09-12 10:49 What should I buy, then, if I want a not-expensive quite-free phone? 2010-09-12 10:49 viric: do you like Android? is that free enough? 2010-09-12 10:49 wpwrak: yoh. can mill away until antenna tuned 2010-09-12 10:50 [commit] kyak: kbd unicode cyrillic map for Ben http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/d7307ad 2010-09-12 10:50 aren't android-running phones quite expensive? 2010-09-12 10:50 compare tuning of tha monster ionon or whatever, you linked me to 2010-09-12 10:51 viric: I have no good advice for you. I switched to the cheapest possible China phones. totally non-free. 2010-09-12 10:51 DocScrutinizer: i'll just try RSSI for now :) 2010-09-12 10:51 RSSI? 2010-09-12 10:51 most former FreeRunner fans seem to have moved on to Nokia N900 or some Android phones from HTC 2010-09-12 10:51 but they are all expensive 2010-09-12 10:51 wolfspraul: maybe if they can run j2me programs fine, I'd be happy, if it is cheap enough :) 2010-09-12 10:51 DocScrutinizer: received signal strength 2010-09-12 10:51 wolfspraul: are you happy with your phone? 2010-09-12 10:51 it's off most of the time 2010-09-12 10:52 maybe I should ask someone else :) 2010-09-12 10:52 wpwrak: yepyep. Anyway the tuning of that monster was by "moving the lower lever", which is kinda exactly what you'll do by milling away the lil foot 2010-09-12 10:53 viric: what you are really looking for doesn't exist right now. cheap & free. 2010-09-12 10:53 imho it doesn't exist 2010-09-12 10:53 ok 2010-09-12 10:54 if you have an upper price limit, well, maybe you should just either get the cheapest Android phone, if you think that's free enough, or forget about the freedom thing altogether until another attempt at a free phone comes along. 2010-09-12 10:54 not even N900 with stock maemo is really a fullfeatured everyday phone and still free 2010-09-12 10:54 ok 2010-09-12 10:54 I planned to do that 2010-09-12 10:54 many people still work on free phones, I consider myself one of them. But admittedly if you look at what i do today, it's quite a stretch to see how that's part of a phone :-) 2010-09-12 10:55 viric: or you reduce expectations about "everyday flawless usage" and actually go for an A7 FR 2010-09-12 10:55 with SHR 2010-09-12 10:55 but I have nothing for you I would dare to offer you as a 'phone', and will not have it for a while I guess 2010-09-12 10:55 DocScrutinizer: what is that? 2010-09-12 10:55 or maybe QtMoko (heard it's also getting nice lately) 2010-09-12 10:56 DocScrutinizer: a7 fr? 2010-09-12 10:56 FreRunner revision A7 2010-09-12 10:56 DocScrutinizer: but he needs to be quite generous in terms of lowering his expectations, and also a bit lucky in terms of his network/area. 2010-09-12 10:56 ack 2010-09-12 10:56 then I agree, he could try, jump into FreeRunner land :-) 2010-09-12 10:56 viric: if you do it, DocScrutinizer told you so, not me, ok? 2010-09-12 10:56 :-) 2010-09-12 10:56 ok :) 2010-09-12 10:57 hides 2010-09-12 10:58 viric: you might want to /join #openmoko, #openmoko-cdevel 2010-09-12 10:58 I tried 2010-09-12 10:58 but they remain silen 2010-09-12 10:58 t 2010-09-12 10:58 viric: ask on -cdevel about status of latest SHR 2010-09-12 10:58 unusual 2010-09-12 10:58 but the problems there are in userland software? 2010-09-12 10:59 with A7 revision, yes mostly 2010-09-12 10:59 is a7 a *hardware* revision? 2010-09-12 10:59 yep 2010-09-12 10:59 ok 2010-09-12 10:59 Isn't there any website listing the freedomness of phones? 2010-09-12 10:59 the one where I finilly managed to push a semi-decent fix for buzz issue 2010-09-12 10:59 I'm at linuxfordevices.com taking a look 2010-09-12 11:00 viric: btw A6 with buzzfix alegedly is even a tad better than A7 2010-09-12 11:01 viric: the freedomness for phones is in such a bad state that any list is mostly a rhetoric exercise anyway. who gets away with what claims of 'openess'. 2010-09-12 11:01 exactly 2010-09-12 11:03 tries compiling gforth again 2010-09-12 11:03 I have a journal explaining a bit about the mobile phone manufacturers, and how they behave... 2010-09-12 11:03 I'll take a look 2010-09-12 11:04 (troubles with worker conditions, where they produce, ...) 2010-09-12 11:07 okay, seriously 2010-09-12 11:07 how come I am the only one with problems when compiling gforth? 2010-09-12 11:09 you are most likely not 2010-09-12 11:10 but I am still stuck at the boot issues I am debugging, so can't try out gforth yet... maybe tomorrow... 2010-09-12 11:10 if you can fix it first, great! 2010-09-12 11:12 viric: [2010-09-12 17:09:19] basic calls work fine... GPRS and GPS too 2010-09-12 11:12 well, it just seems to be a missing file 2010-09-12 11:13 viric: http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/openmoko-cdevel.txt /join #openmoko-cdevel ! 2010-09-12 11:45 [commit] Werner Almesberger: Added antenna tuning "tail" suggested by Joerg. Made board slimmer. http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-wpan/b3374dd 2010-09-12 11:45 [commit] Werner Almesberger: Moved cam/ to atrf/cam/ http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-wpan/f8ae351 2010-09-12 11:45 [commit] Werner Almesberger: atusd/cam/pcb.pl: updated for new board shape http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-wpan/843a0bc 2010-09-12 12:54 [commit] kyak: fbterm depends on fontconfig http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/a863278 2010-09-12 16:05 [commit] Werner Almesberger: BOM work in progress. Completed generation of capacitor characteristics. http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-wpan/c0052fa 2010-09-12 16:05 [commit] Werner Almesberger: Rename bom/yageo-cap.* to bom/yageo.* to keep things simple. http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-wpan/66e5aa5 2010-09-12 16:05 [commit] Werner Almesberger: Adjusted parsing of component values. Now all capacitors get properly selected. http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-wpan/636011c 2010-09-12 16:05 [commit] Werner Almesberger: Moved all capacitor tolerance and _E12_P translations to shared includes. http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-wpan/f2824f1 2010-09-12 16:05 [commit] Werner Almesberger: Added generation of Yageo RC0402 resistors. We can now produce the full BOM. http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-wpan/499df0e 2010-09-12 18:23 http://linux.slashdot.org/story/10/09/12/0344218/Indias-35-7-Inch-Android-Tablet-to-Hit-in-January 2010-09-12 18:25 it would be cool if the actually can make that thing for that price 2010-09-12 18:44 whats this hcnnale for? 2010-09-12 18:44 channel* 2010-09-12 18:47 zombi-: http://en.qi-hardware.com/wiki/Main_Page 2010-09-12 18:47 thanks 2010-09-12 18:48 ahh, totally not what i expected, although interesting :) 2010-09-12 18:49 zombi-: dare i ask what you expected? :P 2010-09-12 18:50 has anyone tried the 2.6.35 patches for OpenWRT? 2010-09-12 18:50 hardware support channel :( 2010-09-12 18:51 hahaha 2010-09-12 18:56 zombi-: ah, but it's kind of support for qi-hardware 2010-09-12 18:56 :) 2010-09-12 20:59 [commit] Carlos Camargo: aaa http://qi-hw.com/p/nn-usb-fpga/0975cd7 2010-09-12 23:31 rafa: nice subtle advertizing in your prompt ;-) 2010-09-12 23:33 rafa: btw, is it still really necessary to pre-fill a swap file with dd ? i thought mkswap ... size does the trick as well ?