2010-09-03 06:00 heh, those wildfire threads on the list are funny. "pico c" :) 2010-09-03 06:40 ah lets use llvm instead ;) 2010-09-03 09:12 kristianpaul, hi, tuxbrain is still not there, is it normal? 2010-09-03 09:13 GNUtoo|laptop: tuxbrain is going into super concentration mode :-) 2010-09-03 09:13 ah ok 2010-09-03 09:13 I think all is fine, he just realized what a time sink chats can be. 2010-09-03 09:13 ah but how can I contact him then? 2010-09-03 09:14 somebody told me I should talk to them 2010-09-03 09:14 email? what do you want, maybe we can help you here? 2010-09-03 09:14 or rather to the one in charge of the technical aspect(david) 2010-09-03 09:14 basically it's about the phone they sell or will sell 2010-09-03 09:14 it was an android phone and they wanted SHR on it 2010-09-03 09:14 I'm very busy 2010-09-03 09:15 GNUtoo|laptop, it's related to GeeksPhone maybe? 2010-09-03 09:15 so I wondered if we could collaborate to evaluate the port 2010-09-03 09:15 yes 2010-09-03 09:15 they point me to the sources etc... 2010-09-03 09:15 I evaluate 2010-09-03 09:15 then contact them by e-mail 2010-09-03 09:15 because I was just pointed to a kernel source 2010-09-03 09:15 and even worse, I'm on 3g 2010-09-03 09:15 with 100M limit 2010-09-03 09:16 but on week-end the limit goes up to 2G 2010-09-03 09:16 ok 2010-09-03 09:16 I'll do then 2010-09-03 09:16 the only problem is that I've tons of mails 2010-09-03 09:16 and reading them trough 3g can eat MBs 2010-09-03 09:16 GNUtoo|laptop, well, i try to contact them if you want 2010-09-03 09:17 ok thanks 2010-09-03 09:17 tell him to contact me via irc or jabber 2010-09-03 09:17 also tell him that I'm the guy he met at fosdem 2010-09-03 09:17 i would like to be at fosdem with them 2010-09-03 09:17 s/he/they 2010-09-03 09:17 :) 2010-09-03 09:17 lol ok 2010-09-03 09:18 the one with the bug device from buglabs 2010-09-03 09:19 it's pespin who contacted me on #openmoko-cdevel and told me about the geeksphone btw 2010-09-03 09:20 methril_work, do you need my jabber account? in case they david doesn't want to use irc 2010-09-03 09:20 he's going to connect 2010-09-03 09:21 i think i've your jabber from SHR ;) 2010-09-03 09:21 ok thanks a lot!!! 2010-09-03 09:21 ok 2010-09-03 09:21 tuxbrain2, I'll PM you 2010-09-03 09:21 there is tuxbrain2 ! :-) 2010-09-03 09:21 thanks a lot 2010-09-03 09:21 hello all :) 2010-09-03 09:21 you are wellcome 2010-09-03 09:21 I can just stay for few mins 2010-09-03 09:22 tuxbrain2: you are selling non-copyleft 'geeks' phones with tons of proprietary technology and no hope that that will ever change? :-) 2010-09-03 09:26 well not selling it actually and I will not selling it until at least it has a GNU/Linux inside :P 2010-09-03 09:29 xiangfu: btw, have you tried the 'new' gmenu2x? 2010-09-03 09:32 hello, the screen of my nanonote gone blank, the device is still reachable via usb. turning off/on doesn't solve the issue. any ideas? 2010-09-03 09:39 qwebirc66005: can you login with ssh? 2010-09-03 09:39 what do you mean with 'reachable via usb'? 2010-09-03 09:39 I still can login via ssh on usb 2010-09-03 09:43 qwebirc66005: hmm. I have seen 1 or 2 cases where the FPC cable between LCM and main board got loose. It could be that. 2010-09-03 09:44 you could open the case and make sure the FPC sits well in the connector, but it's not for the faint hearted. 2010-09-03 09:45 there is a connector only on one side (on the side of the main board), on the other side the FPC is soldered in a hot-pressed process, so there is nothing to fix there, but also normally nothing will disconnect there. 2010-09-03 09:46 have you tried a full cold start? 2010-09-03 09:47 try that too. remove the battery, unplug the USB cable. then plug the USB cable in, see whether the screen comes on (first should be some u-boot output) 2010-09-03 09:47 if it doesn't start automatically after connecting the USB cable, press the power-on button for a good solid 3-4 seconds 2010-09-03 09:47 see whether the screen comes on 2010-09-03 09:48 wolfspraul: trying... 2010-09-03 09:52 wolfspraul: nope, but you gave me an idea, so I strongly pressed the display base and it worked. there is definitely something wrong with the cable. what do you suggest? the device is brand new (just unpacked...) 2010-09-03 09:52 he. good that you pressed! :-) 2010-09-03 09:53 where exactly did you press? 2010-09-03 09:54 the FPC is going through the hinge on the right side (above the microphone, left of the power button) 2010-09-03 09:55 wolfspraul: I pressed just below the display, near the hinge on the center 2010-09-03 09:55 hmm, center. OK. 2010-09-03 09:56 is the LCM constantly on now, or only when you press there? 2010-09-03 09:57 wolfspraul: it's intermittent, when I press above the mic it turns to full-white too 2010-09-03 09:58 I would suspect it's the FPC connector on the side of the mainboard. 2010-09-03 09:58 probably if you would disconnect and reconnect that cable, it will be stable. 2010-09-03 09:58 too bad. What do we do now? 2010-09-03 09:59 we have a number of options. If it would be me, I would open the device and reconnect that cable. It's not that hard, but I don't know how confident you are with something like that. Or whether you want your brand new device to also work like that! (which I would understand) 2010-09-03 10:00 wolfspraul:well, I'm an a techie so I think I could try to fix this. any suggestion? 2010-09-03 10:00 another option is that you return it to where you bought it, we had one such case in the past and fixed it. But shipping a 99 USD device around always makes me cry because sometimes shipping cost can be higher than device costs :-) 2010-09-03 10:00 sure, great 2010-09-03 10:00 let's try! 2010-09-03 10:01 where did you buy it by the way? 2010-09-03 10:01 this is still not how it should be, and in terms of customer support we should guarantee you a fully functioning device 2010-09-03 10:01 wolfspraul: I bought it from hackable-devices.org 2010-09-03 10:02 ok 2010-09-03 10:02 wolfspraul: what do you think causes this ? assembly forgetting to close the connector, so it passes inspection but eventually, the cable falls out ? or do they check for this ? 2010-09-03 10:02 well I hope they don't mind if we move straight to the guts now... 2010-09-03 10:02 wpwrak: since I personally reflashed every nanonote (there is no other way Linux software could have gotten onto them), no, definitely. It did work. 2010-09-03 10:03 I have seen one other case exactly like qwebirc66005 2010-09-03 10:03 it must have worked when I reflashed, but then x months later the screen was dark 2010-09-03 10:03 I think it's the price you pay for having a fpc cable and connector 2010-09-03 10:03 qwebirc66005: let's start! :-) 2010-09-03 10:03 do you have a small screwdriver? 2010-09-03 10:04 wolfspraul: wow ! reflashed 1000 devices. where do they sell whatever motivation enhancer you took for that ? :) 2010-09-03 10:04 fpc being flexible printed circuit? (as I don't expect you to use federal prison camps) 2010-09-03 10:04 wpwrak: I will reflash another thousand in a week or so. 2010-09-03 10:04 first day was 280 I think, then 320, then 380. got better. 2010-09-03 10:05 it's a lot of fun to work with many devices 2010-09-03 10:05 hardware is really really interesting. 2010-09-03 10:05 wolfspraul: please wait jus a moment, searching for right tool... 2010-09-03 10:05 wpwrak: unfortunately not all plastic parts are up yet http://www.almesberger.net/misc/ben/scan/ 2010-09-03 10:05 wolfspraul: sounds like connecot not fully close or cable not fully inseerted then. hmm, tricky to test 2010-09-03 10:05 so I could explain to qwebirc66005 how to lift off the plastic part above the keyboard 2010-09-03 10:06 bartbes: how do you think they make them so cheap ? ;-) 2010-09-03 10:06 wpwrak: I always thought they used cosmic radiation to send messages :P 2010-09-03 10:07 man I hope the qwebirc66005 surgery will not end in a disaster. he is brave though I like that... 2010-09-03 10:07 wolfspraul: (scans) yeah, mill is busy making boards these days :) not all the time, but often enough that i don't have a break long-enough for a big scan. 2010-09-03 10:07 -) 2010-09-03 10:07 *signals 2010-09-03 10:08 bah, opening the ben isn't too bad :) not having to take out the pcb actually helps. sometimes can get caught somewhere 2010-09-03 10:08 still on the Ya I think we can improve some things 2010-09-03 10:09 not those nasty little plastic hooks that break off etc. 2010-09-03 10:09 wolfspraul: (ya) definitely. i'd go for a "no click" design. just simple parts and screws. may add a cent or two to assembly cost, though. 2010-09-03 10:09 I am even wondering whether we should do plastic on Ya or another material. 2010-09-03 10:09 yes I agree 2010-09-03 10:09 wolfspraul: what materials are you considering ? 2010-09-03 10:09 don't know 2010-09-03 10:10 mercury 2010-09-03 10:10 asbestos 2010-09-03 10:10 "keep refrigerated at all times" 2010-09-03 10:10 wolfspraul: ok, I dissected the bug, so now what? 2010-09-03 10:10 bartbes: i could offer lead ;-) 2010-09-03 10:10 dissected? 2010-09-03 10:10 do you have a screwdriver? 2010-09-03 10:10 turn the nanonote around 2010-09-03 10:11 remove battery, unplug USB cable 2010-09-03 10:11 tuxbrain_away: speaking of which ... i still have those 20 counterweights waiting for you. how did the enquiry with TNT go ? 2010-09-03 10:11 looking from the bottom, you should see 4 screws. 2010-09-03 10:11 unscrew them, all 4 2010-09-03 10:11 even though we insisted on them not doing it, one of the 4 screws may be covered under a small white 'do not tamper' label 2010-09-03 10:12 wolfspraul: I already opened (and by the way there were just 3 screws) 2010-09-03 10:12 the one on the left side of the battery (above the battery connector) 2010-09-03 10:12 no there are 4 2010-09-03 10:12 wolfspraul: i'm afraid there may not be many alternatives to plastic. metal would be nice in some regards but also difficult to manufacture. 2010-09-03 10:12 qwebirc66005: look on the left side of the battery, above the battery connector 2010-09-03 10:13 it may be hidden under a small label 2010-09-03 10:13 wolfspraul: well, there is a hole under the label, but no screw... 2010-09-03 10:13 huh? 2010-09-03 10:13 wolfspraul: really.. 2010-09-03 10:13 wolfspraul: wood would be fun for milling (you can do wood very rapidly so that should be cheap). but then you need thick walls or it'll break 2010-09-03 10:13 was the label intact? 2010-09-03 10:13 your device gets more mysterious... 2010-09-03 10:14 wolfspraul: yes, as I can see 2010-09-03 10:14 ok, so when all 4 (or 3) screws are out, turn the device around 2010-09-03 10:14 wait a sec I'm behind I am following here with mine... 2010-09-03 10:14 fabrication date: monday, after the chinese equivalent of the oktoberfest :) 2010-09-03 10:15 qwebirc66005: ok now comes the hard part 2010-09-03 10:15 you need to lift off 1 piece of plastic 2010-09-03 10:15 wolfspraul: also, only things you can cast would scale to larger quantities 2010-09-03 10:16 it's the big piece that is all around the keyboard (and has another piece of metal sitting on top of it, over the speaker/microphone/power button) 2010-09-03 10:16 unfortunately Werner doesn't have a scan of that piece yet, but maybe you can imagine 2010-09-03 10:16 well, cast, stamp, or similar 2010-09-03 10:16 since you unscrewed the 3 screws, the only thing that holds it down now are little plastic hooks on the sides 2010-09-03 10:17 wait let me try this here first 2010-09-03 10:18 yes I just took it off :-) 2010-09-03 10:18 wolfspraul: I already disassebled it, I disconnected the cable too, opening the connector latch 2010-09-03 10:18 wolfspraul: (scan) this one will be hard. i already looked into scanning it, but there's no way to mount it without the fixture showing. and even then there's the problem that there are few even surfaces. i'll probably have to construct a specific fixture for it. similar for scanning the outside of the bottom shell. but that one's much easier. 2010-09-03 10:19 qwebirc66005: wow! 2010-09-03 10:19 well you don't need my assistance, you should become my teacher... 2010-09-03 10:19 well then 2010-09-03 10:19 some new images and stuff -> http://slashhome.se/p/uSD_breakout/ 2010-09-03 10:19 there is actually no need to pull the cable out entirelly 2010-09-03 10:19 wpwrak: ^ 2010-09-03 10:19 just open the latch, pull it out a little, and push it all the way back in 2010-09-03 10:20 then close the latch, turn on, see what happens 2010-09-03 10:20 congratulations for the disassembly btw! 2010-09-03 10:20 wolfspraul: waitasec... 2010-09-03 10:20 Ornotermes: nice and tidy :-) 2010-09-03 10:21 Ornotermes: next step: replace the header with a PCB plus header assembly. like the 0.1" connector i attached here:http://www.almesberger.net/misc/idbg/idbg-soldered.jpg 2010-09-03 10:22 tuxbrain_away: should seriously consider offering this as a hacking kit for the NanoNote (usd_breakout) 2010-09-03 10:22 Ornotermes: after that, you'd almost have industrial production quality. the only thing missing would then be the flat cable 2010-09-03 10:22 qwebirc66005: a word of caution. When you lift off that plastic piece, and also when you put it back in later, please watch 2 things 2010-09-03 10:23 first - there is a thin piece of metal glued onto it. Some people don't believe it but it is metal. 2010-09-03 10:23 what that means is if you bend it, you will not be able to bend it back, it will have some very ugly 'waves' or worse 2010-09-03 10:23 so never try to take that off the plastic 2010-09-03 10:24 wolfspraul: (breakout board) i guess you'd have to produce the cables. then find a source for cheap and small prototype boards, like the one on the picture. then you'd have a nice package. 2010-09-03 10:24 wolfspraul: sorry, same problem, I think the issue is on the other side 2010-09-03 10:24 second, if you look at the bottom side of the piece of plastic, you see a total of 5 plastic 'hooks' that produce this 'click in' effect 2010-09-03 10:24 wolfspraul: add some components and you can even do experiments. "kosmos"-style, if you know them from germany 2010-09-03 10:25 when removing or putting the piece of plastic back in, try to be gentle to those hooks or they can break off (which is not that bad because the screws still hold everything quite well 2010-09-03 10:25 qwebirc66005: hmm. can't really be on other side. 2010-09-03 10:25 you said when you pressed in the middle it worked for a while? 2010-09-03 10:25 hairline fracture in the cable ? 2010-09-03 10:26 maybe it's a problem there? anyway. sounds like you need a replacement. 2010-09-03 10:26 well he said he pressed in the middle and the screen came on? 2010-09-03 10:26 there's some beads there, maybe those have a problem? don't know 2010-09-03 10:26 wolfspraul: yes it worked for a while, but not anymore 2010-09-03 10:26 hairline fractures respond to the weirdest things ... you just need to push the cable in "the right way" 2010-09-03 10:27 wolfspraul: you should remember the fun we had with the debug cable at openmoko. this one also suffered this sort of fractures. 2010-09-03 10:28 wolfspraul: now if I press in the same point, the screen become full-white (what a progress...) 2010-09-03 10:28 where is 'the same point'? 2010-09-03 10:29 wolfspraul: just above the hinge 2010-09-03 10:29 from the left, you first have the speaker, then NAND, then a few passive components and beads, then the FPC, then microphone, then power button 2010-09-03 10:29 Ornotermes: (led) in R(on) we trust ;-) 2010-09-03 10:29 above the hinge? 2010-09-03 10:30 you mean on the side of the LCM? 2010-09-03 10:30 wolfspraul: I press on the lid , below display, above the hinge 2010-09-03 10:31 interesting 2010-09-03 10:31 anyway 2010-09-03 10:31 you need a replacement! that's what will help you :-) 2010-09-03 10:32 just reassemble everything neatly, be as careful as possible we definitely would like to look into this a bit more once it's back one day... 2010-09-03 10:33 for the replacement, since you bought from hackable-devices I'm not sure. maybe the easiest is if Tuxbrain just gives you a new one, and you return this one to Tuxbrain? 2010-09-03 10:33 is that acceptable to you? 2010-09-03 10:33 what do you suggest? (since you have the device in front of you and you know what you planned to do with it...) 2010-09-03 10:34 wolfspraul: were is TuxBrain? 2010-09-03 10:34 Barcelona 2010-09-03 10:35 wolfspraul: okI think it's my best choice. How I should proceed? 2010-09-03 10:36 I suggest you email me, then we take it from there. 2010-09-03 10:36 sorry for the inconvenience, at least you got to do some beginner's hacking on your first day already :-) 2010-09-03 10:36 wolfspraul: :-) 2010-09-03 10:36 from the distance it looks like the second or third device with this kind of LCM problem 2010-09-03 10:37 in about 950 2010-09-03 10:37 wolfspraul: whare are iphone case made off? 2010-09-03 10:37 i like how it feels 2010-09-03 10:37 oh my god 2010-09-03 10:37 :-) 2010-09-03 10:37 it's magic! 2010-09-03 10:38 hahah 2010-09-03 10:38 it's probably a super special super secret super whatever thing 2010-09-03 10:38 ah 2010-09-03 10:38 200 material scientists, phd's, helped by engineering teams from another 50 partner companies, worked together on this magic substance 2010-09-03 10:38 well but to give Apple credit, they do dig deep 2010-09-03 10:39 :O 2010-09-03 10:39 wolfspraul: too bad they forgot the antenna designer :) 2010-09-03 10:39 so seriously, I totally don't know, and probably nobody but apple does 2010-09-03 10:39 ok forgot it 2010-09-03 10:39 wpwrak: lol 2010-09-03 10:39 and if any of their partners who knows speaks even 1 word, no more apple business forever 2010-09-03 10:39 qwebirc66005: please email me at wolfgang@sharism.cc 2010-09-03 10:40 and also, please reassemble the nano nicely, I definitely want to find out more about what happened. 2010-09-03 10:40 wpwrak: there are ceramics cases? 2010-09-03 10:41 may be something related with alumnion i dont know, any way seems plastic is cheaper isnt? 2010-09-03 10:41 Aluminium* 2010-09-03 10:41 kristianpaul: haven't heard of any. at least traditional ceramics tend to be brittle. 2010-09-03 10:42 kristianpaul: afaik, aluminium needs to be milled. so high per-unit cost. 2010-09-03 10:42 wolfspraul: email sent 2010-09-03 10:42 yeah i tought that about ceramics is a shame :( 2010-09-03 10:42 wpwrak: plastic then 2010-09-03 10:43 kristianpaul: there probably some fancy new ceramic that don't have such problems. but that's an entirely new world :) 2010-09-03 10:43 :O 2010-09-03 10:44 as usual, Apple is seriously investing lots of money and brain power into materials 2010-09-03 10:44 i like that, i was told from an mechanic eng about that is been used in europe recently in some areas 2010-09-03 10:44 that = ceramics 2010-09-03 10:44 wpwrak: for the breakout board, are you worried about the cable being too long in terms of the signal? 2010-09-03 10:45 also re-usable mirenal i was told 2010-09-03 10:45 what if the cable is just an FPC? not stable/shielded enough? (the pictures show individually shielded round cables) 2010-09-03 10:47 wolfspraul: eventually, cable length becomes a problem, yes. but i wouldn't worry about that for basic experiments. (led, button, this sort of stuff) 2010-09-03 10:47 wpwrak: you mean another board to make 50 mils ribbon to 100 mils pin head? 2010-09-03 10:48 qwebirc66005: didn't get the mail yet 2010-09-03 10:48 wolfspraul: going to fpc is what i'm recommending for "serious" production. the ribbon cable on the pictures is unshielded. this is just the basic stuff you also have, say, in IDE connectors (before SATA) 2010-09-03 10:48 Ornotermes: yup. should be easier to solder and more stable 2010-09-03 10:49 wpwrak: how long do you think the FPC should be? 2010-09-03 10:49 Ornotermes: just solder everything flat on the PCB, SMT-style 2010-09-03 10:50 wolfspraul: as short as possible but long enough for handling when you make experiments :) 2010-09-03 10:50 Ornotermes: what do you think, 20 cm ? 2010-09-03 10:50 can you translate that to centimeters? 2010-09-03 10:50 maybe 15. probably not shorter 2010-09-03 10:51 .. than 10 :) 2010-09-03 10:51 i have 20cm now 2010-09-03 10:51 20 looks decent 2010-09-03 10:51 i think thats pretty good 2010-09-03 10:51 what pitch do you have on the other side? (the breadboard side) 2010-09-03 10:51 2.54 2010-09-03 10:52 on the pinhead 2010-09-03 10:52 that's the most common? 2010-09-03 10:52 (mm) 2010-09-03 10:52 100 mil, standard header 2010-09-03 10:52 yup 2010-09-03 10:52 also DIP chips have a 100 mil spacing 2010-09-03 10:52 you get a gazillion header types for 100 mil 2010-09-03 10:53 a importaint thing for cable lengt is how high frequencys it should handle 2010-09-03 10:54 yup. of course, nobody will to microwave designs on a breadboard .. :) 2010-09-03 10:54 s/to/do/ 2010-09-03 10:54 qwebirc66005: can you give me your email address here? still didn't get your mail. just in case, mine is wolfgang@sharism.cc 2010-09-03 10:55 wolfspraul: dsplabsdsplabs.net 2010-09-03 10:55 ok thx got it 2010-09-03 11:01 i have som capacitace measures now :) 2010-09-03 11:02 Ornotermes: and, how bad is it ? :) 2010-09-03 11:07 wpwrak: not too bad, working on table... 2010-09-03 11:14 wpwrak: its a table on my page now 2010-09-03 11:19 not so bad 2010-09-03 11:20 and now the inductance :) 2010-09-03 11:27 i think that's a bit hard for me to measure right now :P 2010-09-03 11:30 and i think it's a even lesser problem in the real wold since all ports have pull ups 2010-09-03 11:31 and to send clock signals D09 has the advantage of being between power leads 2010-09-03 11:36 [commit] Juan64Bits: ERC report generated. http://qi-hw.com/p/xue/4402fb5 2010-09-03 11:39 Ornotermes: a good test would be so simply send out a signal and watch it on a scope. 2010-09-03 11:39 yeah 2010-09-03 11:39 but i'm a bit after on the software 2010-09-03 11:41 http://www.almesberger.net/misc/ben/clk.c 2010-09-03 11:41 this program generates a 16 MHz MMC clock signal 2010-09-03 11:42 it's a bit ugly, sorry about that. for "nice" software, see http://projects.qi-hardware.com/index.php/p/ben-blinkenlights/ 2010-09-03 11:46 how do i compile it? 2010-09-03 11:47 it was something about linking to the the compiler on the deskop system? 2010-09-03 12:32 ah, you need the toolchain. if you follow the openwrt build instructions, they will generate one for you. then you link the executables (mipsel-openwrt-linux-*) somewhere into your PATH. (or adjust the PATH) 2010-09-03 12:35 i think i have the binarys but i don't have any alias to the compiler 2010-09-03 12:35 it's a pity there is no simple host toolchain package. in openmoko, we had a tarball with the toolchain and the most important libraries (you need these too), and i think it worked very well. someone should do the same for the ben. 2010-09-03 12:36 lemme see where it hides ... 2010-09-03 12:36 openwrt-xburst/staging_dir/toolchain-mipsel_gcc-4.3.3+cs_uClibc-0.9.32/usr/bin/mipsel-openwrt-linux-gcc 2010-09-03 12:37 you can just ln -s wherever.../openwrt-xburst/staging_dir/toolchain-mipsel_gcc-4.3.3+cs_uClibc-0.9.32/usr/bin/*Â Â /usr/local/bin/ 2010-09-03 12:38 when you run the things these, they will remember the include paths in the openwrt tree, so #includes pick up the right files 2010-09-03 12:39 oh, ok 2010-09-03 12:39 this is one of the reasons to prefer languages like python :P 2010-09-03 12:52 naw, there's nothing magic about cross-compilation. someone just has to set up the basics. 2010-09-03 12:53 the problem with not having an easily available toolchain is that people may start to develop irrational development models 2010-09-03 12:53 e.g., make their build processes depend on a distribution 2010-09-03 12:54 i've seen this at openmoko, where they used openembedded as their build system. so instead of just invoking "make" on their project, they would feed it into their local OE system and then run an OE build. naturally, with massive overhead. 2010-09-03 12:55 folks, has ruby been ported (or is present currently) to the nano-note ? 2010-09-03 12:56 OE would take care of the "magic" of doing the cross-compilation, but just in a horribly inefficient way. and of course, many were unhappy about the problems they encountered in this model. 2010-09-03 12:56 (this wasn't purely insane, since some of the work depended on libraries and such that were somewhat hard to obtain or even part of the development. but still.) 2010-09-03 13:03 wpwrak: so OE is blobbed , bitbake may be? 2010-09-03 13:06 alcy: ruby is openwrt repos 2010-09-03 13:07 kristianpaul, cool..thanks ! 2010-09-03 13:08 alcy: you need supprot about how install it? 2010-09-03 13:08 support* 2010-09-03 13:09 wpwrak: i personlly see OE kidn of blobbed, comapred to openwrt build process, but damm they have thousands of packages 2010-09-03 13:09 wpwrak: i added it to the path instead 2010-09-03 13:09 kristianpaul...no, no...just that I am unable to give time to my nano-note...so, just to be involved with it ( for my sysadmin stuff), wanted to know about ruby...hopefully irb will run on it. :) 2010-09-03 13:11 k 2010-09-03 13:18 could someone please define how the term 'blob' applies to OE? 2010-09-03 13:19 I've always associated 'blob' with proprietary binary code, distributed but not open to review or change 2010-09-03 13:19 OE seems not to fit into that view 2010-09-03 13:20 ohh sorry !! 2010-09-03 13:21 s/blob/bloat 2010-09-03 13:21 emeb: ^ 2010-09-03 13:21 kristianpaul: thanks for the clarification 2010-09-03 13:21 emeb: you for point it 2010-09-03 13:21 no argument that OE is a huge buildsystem 2010-09-03 13:21 that said - it seems to work pretty well (I use it on beagleboard) 2010-09-03 13:22 yeah me too on the nano 2010-09-03 13:22 just the build system is not so simple as in openwrt i think 2010-09-03 13:22 agree 2010-09-03 13:22 for example bitbake.. 2010-09-03 13:23 I've also been looking at buildroot for really simple stuff. 2010-09-03 13:23 wich files? 2010-09-03 13:23 kristoffer: hey 2010-09-03 13:23 kristoffer: did you documented how was added support for ben nanonote in OE? 2010-09-03 13:23 [commit] Juan64Bits: Routing current sensors. http://qi-hw.com/p/xue/cb21a9a 2010-09-03 13:24 i think i have clear about build the userland 2010-09-03 13:24 but no else... 2010-09-03 13:24 like what to do if i want apply a patch to a package 2010-09-03 13:24 or build with gcc especific arcuitecture options 2010-09-03 13:25 you know, ge tot the custom 2010-09-03 13:25 s/ge tot/get to 2010-09-03 13:27 kristianpaul, one sec 2010-09-03 14:07 wpwrak: got it to work :) 2010-09-03 14:07 but i didn't got 16 MHz 2010-09-03 14:17 wpwrak: http://gallery.slashhome.se/main.php?g2_itemId=3007 MSCCDR = 0 2010-09-03 15:05 Ornotermes: how do you like that gw instek scope? 2010-09-03 15:12 emeb: i don't have that much experience in scopes, but it serves me well 2010-09-03 15:13 thx - trying to choose between that & Rigol 2010-09-03 15:13 there is some things that feels odd but it doesn't have to be the scope it self 2010-09-03 15:14 interesting 2010-09-03 15:14 like if i measure something thats 0V it shows a slightly negative voltage 2010-09-03 15:15 and there is some over hearing between the channels 2010-09-03 15:15 cross-talk? 2010-09-03 15:16 does that happen at all vertical scales, or only on the sensitive settings? 2010-09-03 15:16 emeb: i try to find a dumt that shows what i mean 2010-09-03 15:16 Ornotermes: nice signal. the clock frequency is odd, though. 2010-09-03 15:17 wpwrak: have you checked the signal output your self? 2010-09-03 15:17 Ornotermes: yes, I get a perfect 16.00 MHz. 2010-09-03 15:17 strange 2010-09-03 15:18 can it be that my scope is too slow? 2010-09-03 15:18 it's a 40MHz scope 2010-09-03 15:19 Ornotermes: doubt it. if it's too slow, this usually means that the analog bandwidth it soo low 2010-09-03 15:19 what is the sample rate ? 2010-09-03 15:20 wpwrak: http://www.valuetronics.com/New_Instek_GDS-1042.aspx 2010-09-03 15:20 emeb: some rigols have very deep memory. that's extremely useful for analyzing complex signals, particularly digital ones 2010-09-03 15:20 wpwrak: yes - even the low-end Rigols have 1Msamp 2010-09-03 15:21 emeb: (i have a ds1102c) also the logic analyzer is a rather nice feature, even though it has a number of design flaws. 2010-09-03 15:21 wpwrak: I've seen that. Seems handy, but too much in one box 2010-09-03 15:21 I'd rather have a separate LA 2010-09-03 15:22 and spend more on analog BW 2010-09-03 15:22 Looks like the 150MHz Instek scope has a good price and nice features 2010-09-03 15:22 Ornotermes: 250 MSa/s. so, sample rate should be no problem 2010-09-03 15:24 emeb: 2 MSa, nice 2010-09-03 15:25 Ornotermes: maybe my program is incomplete. you used clk.c, right ? 2010-09-03 15:26 yup 2010-09-03 15:27 lemme try is on a freshly booted system 2010-09-03 15:27 emeb: http://gallery.slashhome.se/main.php?g2_itemId=3010 and http://gallery.slashhome.se/main.php?g2_itemId=3013 is what i mean 2010-09-03 15:28 it might be from cheap probes or something like that so i can't really say it's the scopes fault :P 2010-09-03 15:31 cheap probes generate distorted signals. yours looks quite clean 2010-09-03 15:33 Ornotermes: yes - that HF feedthru on the edges could be grounding issues with your probes. Not necessarily the 'scope. 2010-09-03 15:33 emeb: "could" ;-) 2010-09-03 15:34 as i said, im not very experienced in scopes... but as always (exept apple) you get what you pay for 2010-09-03 15:34 Ornotermes: ah yes, there's something wrong with clk.c . now i get 250 kHz :) let's see where i screwed up ... 2010-09-03 15:34 wpwrak: yes - deep trace memory, 1Gsps realtime, 150MHz BW for < $1k - seems good 2010-09-03 15:35 wpwrak: the importatint thig is that we get the same results :) 2010-09-03 15:36 Ornotermes: (scope) 2 things to check: probe compensation and ground loop. if your probes some with little springs to attach to the probe head (after pulling off the clip), try once to measure with tese 2010-09-03 15:36 Ornotermes: the wire with spring goes to ground, so you have to have one nearby. you should see quite a difference 2010-09-03 15:37 (freq) i probably write to the wrong register somewhere 2010-09-03 15:37 wpwrak: i check probe compensation once in a while, but it might be the grounding 2010-09-03 15:38 i tried the settings first with "poke" and then updated clk.c, so if i missed a register that already had a good value from poke, that would explain it 2010-09-03 15:39 Ornotermes: grounding problems are very common. if you're interested in the topic, you may want to read about resistive probes 2010-09-03 15:40 a while ago i had found a beautiful article about them that compared them with other probe types ... searching... 2010-09-03 15:41 wpwrak: thanks for the tip, it made _some_ difference 2010-09-03 15:41 http://www.sigcon.com/Pubs/straight/probes.htm 2010-09-03 15:42 http://gallery.slashhome.se/main.php?g2_itemId=3016 (both probes grounded near probe) :) 2010-09-03 15:42 good. i'm not sure about the dc offset. maybe the scope needs calibration. that should be somewhere in the menus. 2010-09-03 15:43 you may also want to check if there are any firmware updates. such small bugs are often fixed via firmware. 2010-09-03 15:43 probably, when i use auto set it often changes but i haven't found any really manual settings 2010-09-03 15:44