2010-08-25 00:31 [commit] Andres Calderon: added copper pours http://qi-hw.com/p/xue/8dfb8bb 2010-08-25 01:18 wolfspraul: what i mean is that feeds/packages/Xorg/lib/qt4 is coming from "upstream" 2010-08-25 01:18 and from time to time it is broken due to some commit there 2010-08-25 01:18 ok but which upstream? 2010-08-25 01:18 openwrt 2010-08-25 01:19 which repository are you working against, which branch? 2010-08-25 01:19 it comes from openwrt packages directly 2010-08-25 01:19 Updating feed 'packages' from 'svn://svn.openwrt.org/openwrt/packages' 2010-08-25 01:19 do you compile from source or are you talking about problems with packages others have built? 2010-08-25 01:19 is that the OpenWrt development trunk? 2010-08-25 01:20 yes. 2010-08-25 01:20 ah OK 2010-08-25 01:20 well you should probably expect some breakage there, no? 2010-08-25 01:20 no 2010-08-25 01:20 i expect them to test, then commit 2010-08-25 01:21 I don't know exactly how mirko works on qt4 stuff, either he works there, and then merges into the stable branches, or the other way round? 2010-08-25 01:21 if that's the equivalent of an unstable repo, maybe the testing is just 'in progress' 2010-08-25 01:22 I want to start doing some testing of my own on the NanoNote, and document it, but it will only be based on what we have in openwrt-xburst and the package feed on qi (which is months old right now, so doesn't really help...) 2010-08-25 01:23 hm.. i'm surprised to hear this from you 2010-08-25 01:24 actually, qi-packages are updated quite freqeuntly, just have a look at "latest updates" 2010-08-25 01:26 misunderstanding 2010-08-25 01:27 I mean a repository of pre-built binary .ipk files 2010-08-25 01:27 did we update it? if so I indeed missed it, let me check... 2010-08-25 01:27 ah, it's updated together with the latest built 2010-08-25 01:27 which was.. maybe you are right, a month ago 2010-08-25 01:28 no we didn't :-) April 29... 2010-08-25 01:28 http://downloads.qi-hardware.com/software/packages/openwrt/xburst/latest/ 2010-08-25 01:28 we are talking about different things 2010-08-25 01:28 I think 2010-08-25 01:29 anyway I am trying to understand how you can feel better about qt4, because I think mirko is doing quite a bit of work there, and if you sync where you look with mirko, maybe things will get better? don't know 2010-08-25 01:31 hmm, looks like packages weren't rebuilt with the latest image.. 2010-08-25 01:32 i'm not sure it is only mirko who commits to openwrt packages directly 2010-08-25 01:37 you mean to openwrt.org ? no sure not there are many people I think 2010-08-25 01:37 what are you trying to achieve? 2010-08-25 01:38 by installing prebuilt .ipks from openwrt.org you are leaving what anybody tests on a NanoNote, even tries to test :-) 2010-08-25 01:38 you are probably also not staying inside the upstream Backfire release, do you? 2010-08-25 01:39 i try to build the latest opwnert-xburst image 2010-08-25 01:39 from our git 2010-08-25 01:39 but building of qt4 fails due to some previous commit 2010-08-25 01:40 kyak, we guessed yesterday that the pre-built .ipk files were automatically built along with the official release images but it seems that the repository of .ipks can be rebuilt independently of the official image releases 2010-08-25 01:40 unclouded: sure, yes 2010-08-25 01:41 ( not that's directly relevant to the current discussion) 2010-08-25 01:41 i don't pay a lot of attention to pre-built .ipk files because i usually include all the software i need in my custom image 2010-08-25 01:42 tslib.cpp:42:19: error: tslib.h: No such file or directory 2010-08-25 01:42 this is the error building qt4 2010-08-25 01:43 i don't knwo what was the update, but someone definitely missed some dependencies 2010-08-25 03:33 [commit] Werner Almesberger: Introduce PLATFORM_ENTER, replacing the old PLATFORM_SETUP for DFU mode http://qi-hw.com/p/f32xbase/5ce904b 2010-08-25 03:37 [commit] Werner Almesberger: Got "cntr" to show signs of life. It was the watchdog, as usual. http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-wpan/3584b5b 2010-08-25 05:55 [commit] Werner Almesberger: The parasitic capacitance of the three probe input pins and R1 formed a http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-wpan/81ab679 2010-08-25 05:55 [commit] Werner Almesberger: Added user-space counter utility. http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-wpan/4d49921 2010-08-25 06:58 Hello all, 2010-08-25 06:59 I seem to be having trouble with getting into usbboot. I have tried different cables (of which at least two positively worked with the unit before), shortening the usb-pins, not shortening them etc. No avail, I cannot get back into usb boot mode. 2010-08-25 07:00 Now, this happened after I (apparently successful :(Â Â ) erased the NAND as per the wiki instructions, in preparation to re-flashing. 2010-08-25 07:00 what do you see in dmesg? 2010-08-25 07:00 Any ideas what else I can try? I have tried on two ubuntu machines so far, no avail 2010-08-25 07:00 also, the suggested way is reflash_ben.sh.. why do you want to do it by hand? 2010-08-25 07:01 reflash_ben.sh thre errors and did not proceed with flashing, thats why I cose to use usbboot. 2010-08-25 07:01 thew 2010-08-25 07:01 threw. damn ;) 2010-08-25 07:02 what about dmesg? 2010-08-25 07:02 dmesg is /var/log/messages - no messages, there is no new device present. 2010-08-25 07:03 is your usb port functioning? 2010-08-25 07:03 strange, isn't it... 2010-08-25 07:03 try to connect other device to the same port 2010-08-25 07:03 yes, I have checked that (and, used different ports, and, as mentioned, two different machines). 2010-08-25 07:04 ie. a USB harddrive, using about the maximum power, works fine as do usb thumbdrives. 2010-08-25 07:04 do you see the red LED when you plug in Ben? 2010-08-25 07:04 better. 2010-08-25 07:06 so, just to make suer I am not getting anything wrong here: I do have to take out the battery, wait, then connect the USB cable, then shorten the usb pins, then press power for two seconds, right? then I should see the USB device in lsusb (aas I did just this morning, before desaster struck...)? 2010-08-25 07:07 no need to shorten. if your bootloader is not corrupted, just hold the "U" button while pressing the power on for two seconds 2010-08-25 07:08 someone just worked magic on my device. after trying at least 20 times, now I seem to be in usb boot mode (and, btw, the power-U mode didn't work for me, sorry). 2010-08-25 07:25 Ok, I'm good, the official version re-flashed fine. Thanks for holding your hands over my head ;) 2010-08-25 07:55 What is needed to build a libre hardware webcam? 2010-08-25 08:05 orly_owl: how libre do you want to have it? 2010-08-25 08:05 As much as possible. 2010-08-25 08:05 he :-) 2010-08-25 08:06 I sense mocking. 2010-08-25 08:06 you need to tell us more about your background and what you try to achieve 2010-08-25 08:06 oh no 2010-08-25 08:06 totally not 2010-08-25 08:06 the best free camera I know right now is the Elphel 353 2010-08-25 08:06 but it's expensive and can hardly be called a 'webcam' 2010-08-25 08:06 ok 2010-08-25 08:06 yes i know it 2010-08-25 08:06 it's really a _long_ story with the 'libre' 2010-08-25 08:07 should the entire production process be openly documented? should all machines using during production be openly documented? should the entire production process be free of patents? 2010-08-25 08:07 those things are nearly impossible 2010-08-25 08:07 I hear that the chipset/cpu it uses can output ogg video, which is nice. 2010-08-25 08:07 unless you want to go back to something like the flintstones 2010-08-25 08:07 yes and no 2010-08-25 08:07 the older Elphel 323 had an Ogg Theora encoder in the fpga, but it was never forward-ported to 353 2010-08-25 08:08 looks up fpga 2010-08-25 08:08 k 2010-08-25 08:08 just to finish the 'libre', some projects that are not satisfied with the state of things in the IC world use fpgas 2010-08-25 08:08 why did they drop it 2010-08-25 08:08 but fpgas themselves are super proprietary ICs 2010-08-25 08:08 :/ 2010-08-25 08:08 yeah well 2010-08-25 08:09 if hardware is neglected for 20+ years that's what happens 2010-08-25 08:09 some people think you can design a 'freedom box' with Marvell technology :-) 2010-08-25 08:09 it becomes rubbish like mr pc bios? 2010-08-25 08:09 Gandhi shopping for some AK47s... 2010-08-25 08:09 :o 2010-08-25 08:09 now that's an analogy i understand! 2010-08-25 08:09 when you say 'webcam', what specs and pricepoint do you have in mind? 2010-08-25 08:10 and why libre, which part should be libre? 2010-08-25 08:10 cheap as hell, VGA 2010-08-25 08:10 the camera modules foudn in pretty much all webcams are proprietary ICs that an just give you jpegs 2010-08-25 08:10 it's a CMOS image sensor + IC logic to create JPEGs 2010-08-25 08:10 the internal firmware should be libre abd the circuitry 2010-08-25 08:10 is that libre enough? 2010-08-25 08:10 well that's why I'm asking 2010-08-25 08:10 well i guess i want a libre IC 2010-08-25 08:11 for the Elphel cameras this type of openess/freedom would by far not be enough 2010-08-25 08:11 oh 2010-08-25 08:11 not flexible enough, too much hard coded in IC 2010-08-25 08:11 but maybe for you that's OK? 2010-08-25 08:11 um 2010-08-25 08:11 I assume you don't want to make your own libre CMOS 2010-08-25 08:11 i dont know 2010-08-25 08:11 unless you have a few billion USD for make a libre IC foundry 2010-08-25 08:11 ah right 2010-08-25 08:11 s/for make/to make/ 2010-08-25 08:11 not handy, no 2010-08-25 08:12 left my walet at home 2010-08-25 08:12 wallet 2010-08-25 08:12 you want an external USB webcam? 2010-08-25 08:12 yeah 2010-08-25 08:12 there are no good camera/video standards in USB land, right? 2010-08-25 08:12 actually there is 2010-08-25 08:12 oh good. didn't know. 2010-08-25 08:12 UVC has brought some order 2010-08-25 08:13 yep 2010-08-25 08:13 great, so there is a standard USB procotol now? 2010-08-25 08:13 logitech are making UVC webcams 2010-08-25 08:13 then maybe you can treat everything behind USB as a black box, and that's free enough? 2010-08-25 08:13 kinda like a 3G dongle 2010-08-25 08:13 yeah its a standard afaik 2010-08-25 08:13 USB video device class 2010-08-25 08:13 not that I am satisfied with that but I just try to understand your motivations... 2010-08-25 08:13 https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/USB_video_device_class 2010-08-25 08:14 I assume there are Linux drivers for that 2010-08-25 08:14 yep 2010-08-25 08:14 so why don't you just buy a UVC webcam and done? 2010-08-25 08:14 why would i be here if that was the case? :p 2010-08-25 08:15 my motivations are: webcams have a massive markup on them, dont claim to support GNU+Linux on the box and are of (what i think is) poor video quality 2010-08-25 08:16 i feel ripped off paying $50 to find that it cannot provide smooth video 2010-08-25 08:16 ok, #1 - #3 2010-08-25 08:16 #2 seems just a printing problem? 2010-08-25 08:16 well 2010-08-25 08:16 yes but 50 USD retail for an entire product is a great pricepoint 2010-08-25 08:16 that thing costs maybe 12 USD or so in China 2010-08-25 08:16 if it's 50 in BestBuy, for example 2010-08-25 08:17 maybe 15 USD in China, but that's it 2010-08-25 08:17 its more the case of being able to walk in to a shop and /know/ that this webcam will work on my GNU+Linux system. and i can say to someone who asks what webcam to buy 'look for on the box' 2010-08-25 08:17 ok but above you said you want a libre IC 2010-08-25 08:18 that's a massively bigger undertaking 2010-08-25 08:18 and it would need to be driven by desires beyond convenience or what's written on the box 2010-08-25 08:18 that's the only way to stop it being a black box, isn't it? 2010-08-25 08:18 yes sure 2010-08-25 08:18 so there is Elphel, you know it already 2010-08-25 08:18 yep 2010-08-25 08:18 wonderful people, I visited them in Salt Lake City a few months ago actually 2010-08-25 08:19 the cameras are expensive though, 1000-2000 USD until it's all said and done 2010-08-25 08:19 yeah :/ 2010-08-25 08:19 and that is not going to change, it may even go up 2010-08-25 08:19 but these cameras exist, for many years, Elphel is a true pioneer in copyleft hardware 2010-08-25 08:19 on the practical side, well, it's a long long way to what you are used to 2010-08-25 08:19 auto-focus, auto-zooming, auto-whatnot 2010-08-25 08:20 all missing 2010-08-25 08:20 mhm 2010-08-25 08:20 who buys their cameras? 2010-08-25 08:20 very widely distributed 2010-08-25 08:20 some winemakers are watching the ripeness of their grapes 2010-08-25 08:20 oceanographic institutes 2010-08-25 08:21 military (flew on global hawk), tanks 2010-08-25 08:21 isn't google using elphel for street view? 2010-08-25 08:21 ah interesting 2010-08-25 08:21 yes 2010-08-25 08:21 many industrial applications 2010-08-25 08:21 it goes case by case 2010-08-25 08:22 but really I think what you are after is something totally different 2010-08-25 08:22 and maybe impossible 2010-08-25 08:22 what those tiny camera modules / black boxes in smartphones etc. can do nowadays is just unbelievable 2010-08-25 08:23 and whether they cost 10 or 20 USD, it's really all zero, because the real thing behind those innovations are many years and multi-billion USD investments by many companies 2010-08-25 08:23 wolfspraul, wasn't it global hawk that used no encryption for sending/receiving the data and talibs learned to receive the images from it? :D 2010-08-25 08:23 so when you come and really want to free something, suddenly you look at this huge pile of work, for years you would have only totally non-competitive stuff, etc. 2010-08-25 08:24 to compare, if I build a free phone for you now, I would be very happy if it could compete with the GSM phones in the early 90s 2010-08-25 08:24 another camera project we are just starting now is called Xue 2010-08-25 08:25 it's a different concept from Elphel, tries to be much cheaper 2010-08-25 08:25 http://en.qi-hardware.com/wiki/Xue 2010-08-25 08:25 I think it's great too, but will take at least several months before we even have first prototype boards, then there will be no software, etc. 2010-08-25 08:25 and we won't have something to compete with your 50 USD webcam for a long time 2010-08-25 08:26 so basically 2010-08-25 08:26 a few billion $ is needed to start anything 2010-08-25 08:26 no, I didn't say that 2010-08-25 08:26 oh 2010-08-25 08:26 you can start anywhere 2010-08-25 08:26 but there will be big compromises you have to make 2010-08-25 08:26 mhm 2010-08-25 08:26 so for example you listed 3 things you don't like about off-the-shelf webcams 2010-08-25 08:27 1. you feel a 50 USD price point 'rips you off' 2010-08-25 08:27 2. you don't like that the box has no label that says "works with GNU/Linux" 2010-08-25 08:27 what was #3? ... :-) 2010-08-25 08:27 3. poor video quality 2010-08-25 08:27 of course the #3 is because of the 50 USD, which is 12-15 at the source in China 2010-08-25 08:28 not exactly enough for anything good on the optical side 2010-08-25 08:28 and also not for a decent CMOS image sensor size 2010-08-25 08:28 at that pricepoint every penny matters, so it's designed to be able to be sold for 50 USD 2010-08-25 08:28 and then you even feel 'ripped off', so maybe you want to buy it for 40 USD, or 30? 2010-08-25 08:29 a bit better, yeah 2010-08-25 08:29 so to make you happy, with your set of motivations, yeah, that's hard 2010-08-25 08:29 someone would indeed need a few billion just for the fun of seeing whether a free camera for 40 USD instead of a proprietary one for 50 USD (if that's even the case in the end) will sell better 2010-08-25 08:29 then make it libre and $200, its a start 2010-08-25 08:29 well, nobody will make that kind of bet :-) 2010-08-25 08:29 he, OK 2010-08-25 08:29 that's a serious margin! 2010-08-25 08:30 yes, once you introduce this kind of margin, then even if the volume is only a few thousand units, let alone several ten thousand, you can do a lot of free innovations 2010-08-25 08:30 hardware is no mystery, no magic as a well known company tries to tell us 2010-08-25 08:31 dell? 2010-08-25 08:31 but I can tell you, very few people are willing to pay 150 USD more for something only because on a very abstract level, somewhere inside, there is something 'libre' 2010-08-25 08:31 :/ 2010-08-25 08:31 most people prefer mentall to make a big black box around hardware, and outsource it to China or elsewhere 2010-08-25 08:31 mentally 2010-08-25 08:31 but a few thousand nerds might, thus spurring libre webcams to a lower price point (hopefully) 2010-08-25 08:32 and they overlook that there's a lot of software that gets ignored that way, but after many years it's a bit late (and hard) to suddenly change that 2010-08-25 08:32 follow the Xue project 2010-08-25 08:32 but the main IC on that board alone will be around 50 USD :-) 2010-08-25 08:32 price to buy just the IC 2010-08-25 08:32 per unit? 2010-08-25 08:32 sure 2010-08-25 08:33 trust me, the people that are selling webcams for 50 USD today have made several billion USD investments over many years 2010-08-25 08:33 methodically 2010-08-25 08:33 this is not falling from the sky suddenly 2010-08-25 08:33 but its still a proprietry IC in Xue isnt it? 2010-08-25 08:33 I'm totally with you on changing the libre aspect, but if you neglect something for 20 years, well maybe it also takes 20 years to catch up? 2010-08-25 08:33 [commit] Andres Calderon: 2 ddr decopling capacitor has been replaced http://qi-hw.com/p/xue/437a1bb 2010-08-25 08:34 there is a Xue commit :-) 2010-08-25 08:34 maybe it does 2010-08-25 08:34 work is happening as we speak... 2010-08-25 08:34 i understood ddr 2010-08-25 08:34 well, we are using (proprietary) FPGAs to start doing GPL licensed ICdesign 2010-08-25 08:34 plus there are no libre FPGAs, and at least to me evolutionary the libre ASIC must come before the libre FPGA 2010-08-25 08:35 and we try to not create dependencies to the specific proprietary technology we are using 2010-08-25 08:35 thats a good plan 2010-08-25 08:35 so we try to keep our GPL licensed IC design portable from Xiling to Altera or other (proprietary) fpga makers 2010-08-25 08:35 that's as good as it gets right now 2010-08-25 08:35 mhm 2010-08-25 08:35 at a later stage, we could aim for our own copyleft licensed ASIC production process, and then also to make our own copyleft fpgas 2010-08-25 08:36 but they still have to be somewhat competitive with the proprietary fpgas at the time, and then you are back to a problem similar like your webcam 2010-08-25 08:36 maybe we can make a free fpga, but it will look like one 10-20 years ago, and be 10* more expensive still 2010-08-25 08:37 like I said, that's what happens when you neglect a big area for many years, and others keep investing while you are not 2010-08-25 08:37 it will change, but it will take time, many years 2010-08-25 08:37 :/ 2010-08-25 08:38 it's not worse than the state of GNU software in the 80's, I think :-) 2010-08-25 08:38 sounds like it 2010-08-25 08:38 the Windows 95 moment, the mega dominance of some proprietary ICs, stil has to come 2010-08-25 08:39 back then you threw some computers and hackers into a room and out came GNU 2010-08-25 08:39 there's also a lot going on in hardware 2010-08-25 08:39 but in the bigger picture (and your perspective is very valid, I am not mocking it), it's really hard to have something competitive 2010-08-25 08:39 like you feeling ripped off with your 50 USD webcam 2010-08-25 08:39 :-) 2010-08-25 08:40 yeah i know 2010-08-25 08:40 but someone has to invest hundreds of millions even more first 2010-08-25 08:40 and that has already happened, that's why this amazing piece of technology (your webcam) can be sold for _ONLY_ 50 USD 2010-08-25 08:40 and not, for example, 10,000 USD 2010-08-25 08:40 consumer pc hardware is overpriced junk half the time 2010-08-25 08:41 the jerky video from webcams just /really/ annoys me :/ 2010-08-25 08:41 well 2010-08-25 08:41 let's do it better, it's hard but I am happy you are showing up here and interested 2010-08-25 08:42 over time your respect for what the current industry, proprietary as it may be, has achieved, will grow 2010-08-25 08:42 :-) 2010-08-25 08:42 meh 2010-08-25 08:42 maybe 2010-08-25 08:44 I am very interested in cameras, we get there. 2010-08-25 08:44 you can follow what's happening at Elphel, or our very own Xue project 2010-08-25 08:45 Xue sounds more reachable at least 2010-08-25 08:45 how did you decide to make a network camera 2010-08-25 08:45 and not a usb webcam 2010-08-25 08:46 I'm not even sure that has been decided like that. 2010-08-25 08:46 first Xue is a derivative from Milkymist, which currently has only USB host support, not USB client 2010-08-25 08:46 and even the USB host support is far from a complete USB implementation (on Milkymist) 2010-08-25 08:47 this is all such a massive construction site I don't even know where to start 2010-08-25 08:47 and then Xue is only in alpha stage right now, not 1 working board exists 2010-08-25 08:47 conceptual stage 2010-08-25 08:47 compared to that Elphel, for example, is shipping working cameras for 8 years or so 2010-08-25 08:48 Xue is really just an idea right now, and we are trying to implement it in reality (=hardware) 2010-08-25 08:48 once we have the first working boards a lot of SW development needs to happen 2010-08-25 08:48 then we can think about what products to go after 2010-08-25 08:49 and then a decision such as 'network camera' vs. 'usb webcam' will be discussed 2010-08-25 08:49 does network camera mean it's powered over Ethernet? 2010-08-25 08:49 does 'usb webcam' mean it must be < 100 USD retail, even less? 2010-08-25 08:49 no idea, really, we are far from even having to discuss such questions 2010-08-25 08:50 oh right 2010-08-25 08:50 we are trying to do the entire Xue electrical design in KiCad 2010-08-25 08:50 a GPL licensed EDA tool 2010-08-25 08:50 EDA 2010-08-25 08:50 lets look that up 2010-08-25 08:51 that's a very daring move, and we will see whether we succeed or have to jump to a proprietary tool again, if we have to make a choice whether we want a functioning board soon, or instead work on freeing tools first 2010-08-25 08:51 mhm 2010-08-25 08:52 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_design_automation 2010-08-25 08:52 hey, cool. the screenshot actually is KiCad! 2010-08-25 08:52 the advantage of the picture policied of the WMF 2010-08-25 08:52 policies 2010-08-25 08:52 in the industry, KiCad is very very rare 2010-08-25 08:52 to say the least 2010-08-25 08:52 :-) 2010-08-25 08:53 I hope we can succeed with Xue in KiCad, we'll see 2010-08-25 08:53 sounds good! 2010-08-25 08:53 to me that feels like 100 questions before "is it a network camera or a usb webcam?" 2010-08-25 08:53 I have "will we be able to pull off the design in KiCad?" as my next big thing... 2010-08-25 08:55 btw, Elphel uses a proprietary EDA software as well 2010-08-25 08:55 :/ 2010-08-25 08:55 they want to make functioning cameras today :-) 2010-08-25 08:55 well it's a big construction site this libre hardware stuff 2010-08-25 08:55 we have to split the workload a little 2010-08-25 08:55 yes its a good start 2010-08-25 08:55 so as long as we keep our goals in mind, it doesn't matter (to me) to use proprietary tools here and there to get started 2010-08-25 08:55 in fact I think that's great focus 2010-08-25 08:56 as long as you work towards total freedom 2010-08-25 08:56 so what motivates you to help with this project? 2010-08-25 08:56 correct 2010-08-25 08:57 it's a lot of fun, learn about new technologies all the time, make new friends. and I think it can become a real (money making) business too. 2010-08-25 08:57 ok 2010-08-25 09:00 so 2010-08-25 09:01 its a long way to the top if you wanna rock and roll? :) 2010-08-25 09:01 it's fun, you should join, but given your starting motivations maybe it's too much to ask from you? don't know 2010-08-25 09:01 oh i feel too involved already 2010-08-25 09:01 if the printing on the box is not right for you, I would just take a big black pen and write "designed for GNU/Linux" on it, to make you happy 2010-08-25 09:01 problem solved :-) 2010-08-25 09:02 im organising stuff will my local user group 2010-08-25 09:02 stuff for software freedom day 2010-08-25 09:02 getting CDs made 2010-08-25 09:02 s/will/with/ 2010-08-25 09:02 cool, maybe someone should buy our lovely little Ben NanoNote 2010-08-25 09:02 i just feel very busy 2010-08-25 09:03 yeah i should organise a group buy after SFD maybe 2010-08-25 09:03 jump into free software on embedded systems, OpenWrt, Jlime (OpenEmbedded), Debian with 32 MB RAM :-) 2010-08-25 09:03 that would be great 2010-08-25 09:03 yep, openwrt on WRT54G here. their documentation is just horrible though. so confusing 2010-08-25 09:04 i put familiar linux on a compaq ipaq. didnt do much with it though 2010-08-25 09:05 [commit] Andres Calderon: mic2550.lib added http://qi-hw.com/p/xue/279ca24 2010-08-25 09:36 [commit] Andres Calderon: 2.5V USB PHY connected http://qi-hw.com/p/xue/9e5231c 2010-08-25 09:36 [commit] Andres Calderon: 2.5V cooper pour extended http://qi-hw.com/p/xue/93e7def 2010-08-25 12:21 http://www-users.cs.york.ac.uk/~susan/joke/cpp.htm 2010-08-25 12:34 lekernel: the truth revealed at long last ;-) 2010-08-25 12:46 is it a joke? 2010-08-25 12:50 ah 2010-08-25 12:50 >>) 2010-08-25 12:51 i'll find one for verilog :p 2010-08-25 13:13 kristianpaul: would you rather use VHDL ? :) 2010-08-25 13:16 wpwrak: noe 2010-08-25 13:16 nope* 2010-08-25 14:35 waves 2010-08-25 15:25 [commit] Juan64Bits: Routing DDR-2 http://qi-hw.com/p/xue/ac39b82 2010-08-25 15:27 murphy's law on USB: one you've built a sufficient large collection of USB devices, all of a sudden you run out of "good" cables and only find those that bring to light all the weird bugs 2010-08-25 15:27 oh that happens to all collectios 2010-08-25 15:27 *+n 2010-08-25 16:25 aha ! bad contact in the connector. plus a bug in my USB library. and just how nicely they work together. 2010-08-25 16:31 [commit] Werner Almesberger: lib/usb.c (open_usb): Stupid beginner's mistake: wrong operator precedence due http://qi-hw.com/p/f32xbase/79396b1 2010-08-25 17:49 [commit] Werner Almesberger: Made communication with CNTR board more robust. Added documentation. http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-wpan/c7303e4 2010-08-25 20:02 hi can someone here help me with compatibility issue? 2010-08-25 20:58 johnny2: hey 2010-08-25 20:58 just people like questions here ;) 2010-08-25 20:58 just ask* 2010-08-25 21:00 hi 2010-08-25 21:01 i need to ask another question not related to compatibility 2010-08-25 21:02 i want to know which inexpensive graphic card can run crysis game on very high setting? 2010-08-25 21:12 johnny2: this channel is not about PC hardware: Qi Hardware is the name of a company that made a handheld Linux-based computer 2010-08-25 21:14 as for your question: inexpensive and high settings Crysis are not really compatible - but most reviews on sites like Anandtech or Tom's Hardware contain Crysis benchmarks so you can see how well the different cards score 2010-08-25 21:22 mth: naw, the company is called something like "sharism at work ltd." :) and i think they're making more bens just these days. 2010-08-25 21:23 well, it's not easy to be both accurate and concise :) 2010-08-25 21:25 mth: wolfgang did a good job at obfuscating his traces ;-) 2010-08-25 21:31 always 2010-08-25 21:32 we started as a Qi Hardware Inc. registered in California 2010-08-25 21:32 oh 2010-08-25 21:33 then later we thought it would be better to make Qi Hardware the community, and have a separate manufacturing company manufacturing stuff. 2010-08-25 21:33 of course the idea is that the manufacturing company is just one of many, since all knowledge is copylefted 2010-08-25 21:33 founded slides about shanzhai vs qi 2010-08-25 21:33 but there is only one manufacturer now, and that is indeed a company registered in Hong Kong, called Sharism at Work Ltd. 2010-08-25 21:35 somewhere in the middle we also had this idea to rename Qi Hardware to "Qi Inside", but only only we got pretty clear language letters from Intel lawyers 2010-08-25 21:35 and probably there were some other ideas as well 2010-08-25 21:36 wolfspraul: (intel) oh, did you ask them or did they spot you the moment you tried ? 2010-08-25 21:36 they spotted the trademark registration 2010-08-25 21:36 ohhh 2010-08-25 21:36 not bad :) 2010-08-25 21:36 and instead of using the official trademark 'opposition' path, threatened in mafia (aha, real world) style with crazy fines etc. 2010-08-25 21:36 well is 1nt3l... soo 2010-08-25 21:37 if I ever have some time, I go back to this 2010-08-25 21:37 I will register a "Wolfgang Inside" trademark and sell t-shirts 2010-08-25 21:37 lol 2010-08-25 21:37 tell them in advance I will do this, and that I will not give in to their threats, instead I see them at the official trademark dispute courthouse 2010-08-25 21:37 something they want to avoid at all costs, backroom deals are so much nicer... 2010-08-25 21:37 but I have no time for this right now... 2010-08-25 21:38 kristianpaul: oh trust me I will do it. I like this kind of stuff. :-) 2010-08-25 21:38 so many windmills to fight in IPland ;-) 2010-08-25 21:38 yes, that's why not now 2010-08-25 21:38 but I really didn't like how they threaten you behind the curtain 2010-08-25 21:38 what is the legal system for? they make a mockery of it 2010-08-25 21:38