2010-05-19 07:20 <qi-commits> Mirko Vogt: Merge branch 'xburst' of git@projects.qi-hardware.com:openwrt-xburst into xburst http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/2232bd3
2010-05-19 07:20 <qi-commits> Mirko Vogt: disable examples (they require additional symbols) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/e831469
2010-05-19 08:04 <foxtrot> hi
2010-05-19 08:05 <foxtrot> anyone know of a source for used/stripped nanonotes?
2010-05-19 08:05 <foxtrot> Im just trying to do MIPS assembly, nothing else
2010-05-19 08:05 <foxtrot> so I dont need any frills
2010-05-19 08:05 <foxtrot> and im poor :)
2010-05-19 09:41 <foxtrot> hi again
2010-05-19 09:41 <foxtrot> (in case anyone replied)
2010-05-19 09:45 <mth> no replies yet
2010-05-19 09:45 <mth> you could use qemu to simulate a MIPS machine
2010-05-19 09:46 <foxtrot> i'd prefer to get a nanonote and operate out of my trousers tho :)
2010-05-19 10:09 <kristianpaul> foxtrot: mips router like wrt54gl are othe starting point
2010-05-19 10:10 <kristianpaul> but nanonote is just neat :)
2010-05-19 10:11 <tuxbrain> foxtrot, I think there is not enough nanonotes out there to a second hand market yet, and the ones who one... well is so lovely machine than I guess it will be hard they want it to sell at lower price than they cost :P
2010-05-19 10:14 <FrankBlues> waves
2010-05-19 10:14 <kristianpaul> indeed
2010-05-19 10:17 <foxtrot> nods
2010-05-19 10:17 <foxtrot> i have a lot of SGI gear that I can do MIPS dev on the desktop/network
2010-05-19 10:18 <foxtrot> but i just want the wow factor of being able to sit in a cafe with the nanonote and actually try to convince someone im actually doing real work :)
2010-05-19 10:19 <tuxbrain> where are you foxtrot?
2010-05-19 10:23 <foxtrot> virginia
2010-05-19 10:29 <tuxbrain> then your best option is to buy it directly at sharims.cc
2010-05-19 10:30 <foxtrot> for $99?
2010-05-19 10:30 <tuxbrain> or get married with a nanonote owner :P
2010-05-19 10:30 <foxtrot> i wish I could like offer a trade :)
2010-05-19 10:49 <FrankBlues> Is there a way to keep ubuntu's network-manager applet to keep from managing the nanonote's usb0 device?
2010-05-19 11:00 <foxtrot> what GUI setup are you using?
2010-05-19 11:03 <FrankBlues> Netbook remix / gnome
2010-05-19 11:08 <foxtrot> sorry i cant help
2010-05-19 11:08 <foxtrot> but id love to see a screenshot :)
2010-05-19 11:09 <FrankBlues> It's not very interesting, just functional.
2010-05-19 11:10 <FrankBlues> I have to wait at a terminal for network-applet to decide it doesn't want to deal with the interface. If I manually ifconfig usb0 before the applet is done, the configuration gets reset at the end of whatever it is network-applet is doing.
2010-05-19 11:10 <foxtrot> i just learned about the nanonote today
2010-05-19 11:11 <foxtrot> but from what i read i didnt even realize it could runXorg
2010-05-19 11:11 <FrankBlues> I haven't seen a fullon X running, just stuff in SDL.
2010-05-19 11:12 <FrankBlues> (the configuration issue is my netbook talking to the nanonote)
2010-05-19 12:43 <sid__> hi, i try to build directfb/lite, install fails. can someone take a look
2010-05-19 12:43 <sid__> http://pastebin.com/MHAGjGFB  http://pastebin.com/aiBYbdMH
2010-05-19 12:43 <sid__> for dfbterm
2010-05-19 13:33 <FrankBlues> waves
2010-05-19 14:09 <jd823592> Hello, are there aims to produce a more useful laptop than ben might be? i mean its nice, i would love to have one but what about a commonly scaled netbook based on similar MIPS arch. with little bigger display and space for battery, wi-fi support or ethernet card would be great.. i thing such device could compete with todays best selling computers
2010-05-19 14:20 <kristoffer> I believe there are already such computers, you googled for it?
2010-05-19 14:25 <jd823592> you really mean open hardware ones?
2010-05-19 14:27 <kristoffer> Well, maybe not fully open, but pretty much known hardware.
2010-05-19 14:29 <jd823592> i just thought it would be nice to create a usable open hardware laptop or netbook or whatever that many of us would love to use and support, because i think you are hope of people who would like to see such device
2010-05-19 14:30 <prpplague> jd823592: there is some discussion from a third party about making a version of the nanonote with an OMAP4 core
2010-05-19 14:30 <prpplague> jd823592: in addition the cherrypal is now available as well
2010-05-19 14:30 <jd823592> cherrypal?
2010-05-19 14:30 <jd823592> what is that?
2010-05-19 14:31 <jd823592> omap4 is ARM.. is it open?
2010-05-19 14:32 <prpplague> http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Cherrypal-Asia/
2010-05-19 14:32 <prpplague> jd823592: open in what way?
2010-05-19 14:33 <jd823592> schematics, all about its design..
2010-05-19 14:33 <jd823592> concept and also specifics of implementation
2010-05-19 14:34 <prpplague> jd823592: well the core is not open, but everything else is
2010-05-19 14:34 <prpplague> or more accurately "will be" when it is available
2010-05-19 14:34 <jd823592> well but i care about the core as well
2010-05-19 14:34 <jd823592> :)
2010-05-19 14:35 <prpplague> jd823592: virtual no cores are open
2010-05-19 14:35 <prpplague> jd823592: as a matter of fact i don't know of a single one
2010-05-19 14:35 <jd823592> i want an open hardware that i can support with free software.. and be happy about the ideology :)
2010-05-19 14:35 <prpplague> jd823592: nothing wrong with ARM to fulfill that need
2010-05-19 14:36 <jd823592> well there still is problem.. if i wanted some manufacturer to create a duplicate of my processor he wouldnt be able.. cause he would not know what my processor really is inside
2010-05-19 14:37 <jd823592> thats a theoretical problem
2010-05-19 14:37 <jd823592> but ideologically it matters
2010-05-19 14:37 <prpplague> jd823592: duplicate of your processor?
2010-05-19 14:38 <jd823592> that was not meant for really
2010-05-19 14:38 <jd823592> i mean
2010-05-19 14:38 <jd823592> i want to be able to ask someone to create few more of those one of which i have in my computer... but thats not possible if i dont have the schematics
2010-05-19 14:39 <prpplague> jd823592: ok you are confusing two different things
2010-05-19 14:39 <jd823592> am I? which ones?
2010-05-19 14:39 <prpplague> jd823592: the core and the reference design are two different things
2010-05-19 14:39 <jd823592> i know
2010-05-19 14:39 <prpplague> jd823592: reference design is open, core is not
2010-05-19 14:39 <prpplague> jd823592: the reference design for the nanonote is open, but the processor is not
2010-05-19 14:41 <prpplague> jd823592: another example of an open design is the beagleboard which has an omap3 , every aspect of the board is open, you even get manufacturing files
2010-05-19 14:41 <prpplague> jd823592: but the parts such as the OMAP3 are closed parts
2010-05-19 14:42 <jd823592> but that is not correct for me... i am able to support nanonote with compatible processor when it comes to instruction set, power supply requirements etc.. not when it comes to drawbacks, bugs etc..... this means that if i take two groups of nanonote clones.. each group created by one manufacturer each of them may manifest different problems
2010-05-19 14:43 <prpplague> jd823592: i did not understand your statement
2010-05-19 14:43 <prpplague> jd823592: please try to explain it again
2010-05-19 14:48 <jd823592> if.. one day there is no one producing nanonotes for example
2010-05-19 14:48 <jd823592> i may take the schematics and let someone create a new one
2010-05-19 14:48 <jd823592> but the processor will be different
2010-05-19 14:48 <prpplague> why would it be different?
2010-05-19 14:49 <jd823592> because the implementation the new manufacturer chooses may look totally different.. only thing he has to do is to make it look the same on the outside
2010-05-19 14:49 <jd823592> but no one never manages to do so
2010-05-19 14:50 <jd823592> and if there was a difference in floating point calculations  than also different results may be met
2010-05-19 14:50 <prpplague> i am sorry i do not understand, the design files are open, the parts list is open, anyone that wants to make a nanonote can do so
2010-05-19 14:50 <prpplague> or beagleboard for that matter
2010-05-19 14:50 <prpplague> just like any one of a thousand boards
2010-05-19 14:51 <jd823592> ok
2010-05-19 14:51 <prpplague> thinks jd823592 might not understand how manufacturing of open design boards works
2010-05-19 14:51 <jd823592> never mind.. i am most probably wrong
2010-05-19 14:51 <jd823592> ok ok
2010-05-19 14:52 <jd823592> what i was told was
2010-05-19 14:54 <jd823592> that the specifications that are called reference design are just guides not specific drawings of how the chip itself looks.. that the core may look completely different and it might be created with a different technology it just has to do the same
2010-05-19 14:54 <jd823592> but i am obviously wrong
2010-05-19 14:54 <jd823592> sry to bother you
2010-05-19 14:55 <prpplague> jd823592: i think you might have misunderstood the role of the reference design and open designs play
2010-05-19 14:55 <jd823592> ok
2010-05-19 14:55 <prpplague> jd823592: anyone can by the parts that make up the nanonote, they give you the list of the parts
2010-05-19 14:56 <prpplague> jd823592: anyone can make the board, they give you gerber files
2010-05-19 14:56 <prpplague> jd823592: they give you all the data for you to make an exact duplication of the nanonote
2010-05-19 14:57 <prpplague> jd823592: let me give you an example
2010-05-19 14:57 <prpplague> jd823592: this is the beagleboard - http://beagleboard.org/hardware
2010-05-19 14:58 <prpplague> jd823592: they provide the design materials, just like nanonote, http://beagleboard.org/hardware/design
2010-05-19 14:58 <prpplague> jd823592: anyone can make their own beagle board, and someone has done just that - http://www.ebv.com/en/products/categories/details/product/ebvbeagle-board.html
2010-05-19 14:58 <prpplague> jd823592: they took the exact same design files and produced an exact copy
2010-05-19 14:59 <prpplague> jd823592: you can too if you want to spend the money
2010-05-19 14:59 <jd823592> but why then did you say that the core is not open
2010-05-19 15:01 <prpplague> jd823592: the core==processor
2010-05-19 15:01 <prpplague> jd823592: the core processor is closed, you can not manufacturer the core processor yourself
2010-05-19 15:01 <prpplague> jd823592: you can _buy_ the processor
2010-05-19 15:02 <jd823592> but i was talking about the processor all the time.. not the board
2010-05-19 15:03 <prpplague> jd823592: and as i said, i know of no core processors that are open
2010-05-19 15:03 <prpplague> jd823592: and if there is one, i am sure you will have trouble finding someone to manufacturer it
2010-05-19 15:04 <jd823592> ok
2010-05-19 15:04 <jd823592> thanks
2010-05-19 15:05 <jd823592> sorry
2010-05-19 15:05 <prpplague> jd823592: manufacturing silicon such as processor takes alot of money
2010-05-19 15:05 <jd823592> i know
2010-05-19 15:05 <prpplague> jd823592: most companies like TI with the OMAP3 and OMAP4 make vast amounts of information about the processor public
2010-05-19 15:05 <jd823592> other thing: is the main board supported by coreboot?
2010-05-19 15:06 <jd823592> probably not, right?
2010-05-19 15:06 <jd823592> that would be nice thing but coreboot might be aimed at different devices
2010-05-19 15:06 <prpplague> jd823592: coreboot, is normally for x86 devices, not ARM.
2010-05-19 15:06 <jd823592> i thought so
2010-05-19 15:06 <prpplague> jd823592: ARM doesn't not require a BIOS like x86
2010-05-19 15:07 <jd823592> ah ok my bad again
2010-05-19 15:11 <jd823592> so if i wanted ARM/MIPS processor based netbook that is open (in the way ben nanonote is (i hope this is right)) what would you recommand me?
2010-05-19 15:12 <prpplague> http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Cherrypal-Asia/   or   http://www.alwaysinnovating.com/touchbook/
2010-05-19 15:13 <jd823592> i apologize
2010-05-19 15:14 <prpplague> ??
2010-05-19 15:14 <jd823592> well i shouldnt have fought for my wrong ideas about how it is
2010-05-19 15:14 <prpplague> ahh, hehe
2010-05-19 15:18 <jd823592> i didnt understand
2010-05-19 15:18 <larsc> i wouldn't recommend the cherrypal. it's quasi-scam
2010-05-19 15:19 <prpplague> larsc: yea i have heard that as well, i ordered one last week, we'll see if it shows up
2010-05-19 15:20 <jd823592> the touch book looks very nice but too expensive for me :(
2010-05-19 15:21 <larsc> prpplague: a friend of mine ordered one. got one with only half of the promised specs and it doesn't even run linux.
2010-05-19 15:22 <larsc> prpplague: http://blog.hep-cat.de/?p=6231#Preliminary
2010-05-19 15:22 <prpplague> larsc: oh thanks for the info
2010-05-19 15:22 <prpplague> looks
2010-05-19 15:25 <prpplague> larsc: interesting
2010-05-19 15:25 <prpplague> larsc: we'll see if mine shows up
2010-05-19 15:25 <prpplague> larsc: to be honest, i was more interested in the case design
2010-05-19 15:26 <prpplague> larsc: the cherrypal was one of the open design platforms i was looking at for an omap4 project
2010-05-19 15:28 <prpplague> larsc: thanks for the info
2010-05-19 15:28 <prpplague> won't get his hope's up
2010-05-19 15:28 <prpplague> larsc: to be honest i wasn't sure about the nanonote either
2010-05-19 15:33 <tuxbrain_away> I don't recoment touchbook either, very loosy quality, very heavy and totally unbalanced, if you put the screen a little more than 90 degrees it will overturn, I have one of those, I have made a second order I quick canceled once I received the first one
2010-05-19 15:34 <prpplague> tuxbrain_away: yea they fixed the overturn issue
2010-05-19 15:37 <kristianpaul> tuxbrain_away: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/10089419.stm
2010-05-19 15:38 <kristianpaul> 3D printing will soon come up against laws made in a world of factories and machine tools, and the battle is likely to be even more intense than that over music and films. Bill Thompson
2010-05-19 15:38 <prpplague> hehe
2010-05-19 15:38 <prpplague> was just discussing making some boards for 3d printing
2010-05-19 15:40 <kristianpaul> :)ç
2010-05-19 15:41 <kristianpaul> prpplague: yeah the goal will be achieved as soon the depositing conductive material and make paths for SMD stuff
2010-05-19 15:41 <kristianpaul> i think
2010-05-19 15:42 <prpplague> kristianpaul: yea
2010-05-19 15:43 <kristianpaul> prpplague: do you have  reprap machine and a nanonote?
2010-05-19 15:43 <prpplague> i have nanonote, but not a reprap or makebot
2010-05-19 15:43 <kristianpaul> ok
2010-05-19 15:44 <prpplague> there are some people using the beagleboard and my trainer board to experiment with reprap, depending on how their tests go, i might make a reprap i/o board
2010-05-19 15:44 <prpplague> are you familiar with the beagleboard?
2010-05-19 15:45 <kristianpaul> i just saw some pics and read some basic stuff some moths ago
2010-05-19 15:45 <kristianpaul> i think nanonote board could be used to experimentar driving a reprap/cnc machine
2010-05-19 15:45 <prpplague> manufactures and sells the tainer board http://www.elinux.org/BeagleBoard_Trainer
2010-05-19 15:47 <kristianpaul> how much?
2010-05-19 15:47 <prpplague> sells for $59.00
2010-05-19 15:47 <prpplague> the beagleboard retails for $149.00
2010-05-19 15:47 <kristianpaul> ouch
2010-05-19 15:48 <prpplague> for which item?
2010-05-19 15:49 <kristianpaul> beagle
2010-05-19 15:49 <prpplague> ahh
2010-05-19 15:49 <prpplague> kristianpaul: why do you feel the the $149 is excessive?
2010-05-19 15:51 <kristianpaul> a nanonote is 99 :)
2010-05-19 15:51 <kristianpaul> with baord + screen + case + keryboard
2010-05-19 15:51 <kristianpaul> and still expensive for losts of countries around the world
2010-05-19 15:52 <prpplague> yea, problem is that the nanonote doesn't provide a platform to develop on for newer technologies such as android that allow people to gain skills for work
2010-05-19 15:53 <kristianpaul> well... android... google ... :)
2010-05-19 15:54 <kristianpaul> you can port android to a nano if you want
2010-05-19 15:56 <prpplague> indeed, problem is that many of the new cell phones will have the same processor as the beagle, hence it provides a good test bed
2010-05-19 15:56 <prpplague> but i understand your statement
2010-05-19 15:56 <kristianpaul> thanks
2010-05-19 15:56 <prpplague> hence the reason we are looking to put OMAP4 in the nanonote
2010-05-19 15:57 <prpplague> to provide a good platform for devrs to use for practical development on omap4
2010-05-19 15:57 <prpplague> omap4 based nanonote will be more expensive though
2010-05-19 15:58 <kristianpaul> yes and remeber ingenic allow us make something that TI will no
2010-05-19 16:04 <prpplague> kristianpaul: i am sorry i did not understand your statement
2010-05-19 16:06 <kristianpaul> prpplague: i had read the ingenic will give best support for this chips
2010-05-19 16:08 <larsc> when it comes to specs and datasheet ti is actually more open then ingenic
2010-05-19 16:08 <kristianpaul> oh
2010-05-19 16:08 <prpplague> kristianpaul: ahh right, well, support isn't an issue, hehe
2010-05-19 16:08 <kristianpaul> price !
2010-05-19 16:08 <prpplague> is guessing no one has done a /whois on prpplague
2010-05-19 16:09 <larsc> should we? ;)
2010-05-19 16:09 <kristianpaul> :)
2010-05-19 16:10 <kristianpaul> ahh you ! the man in facebook ;)
2010-05-19 16:10 <prpplague> the main in facebook?
2010-05-19 16:10 <prpplague> the man in facebook?
2010-05-19 16:10 <kristianpaul> just kidding
2010-05-19 16:10 <prpplague> ahh
2010-05-19 16:10 <prpplague> has no sense of humor
2010-05-19 16:10 <prpplague> :)
2010-05-19 16:10 <kristianpaul> wonder how many time our names are in facebook
2010-05-19 16:11 <kristianpaul> prpplague: ok sorry
2010-05-19 16:11 <prpplague> kristianpaul: hehe
2010-05-19 16:11 <prpplague> kristianpaul: a nanonote style omap4 platform would probably be around $199
2010-05-19 16:11 <kristianpaul> as larsc said seems true TI provides lots of data
2010-05-19 16:11 <kristianpaul> ahh you
2010-05-19 16:11 <kristianpaul> yeh i remenber
2010-05-19 16:12 <prpplague> kristianpaul: we are just researching it right now
2010-05-19 16:12 <kristianpaul> but
2010-05-19 16:12 <prpplague> i've already gutted one of my nanonotes and have the lcd and keyboard working with omap4
2010-05-19 16:12 <kristianpaul> hmm
2010-05-19 16:12 <kristianpaul> what about avr32 ??
2010-05-19 16:12 <prpplague> TI doesn't sell avr32
2010-05-19 16:12 <kristianpaul> yes i know
2010-05-19 16:13 <kristianpaul> i wasd thinking in avr and its great support to free sofware
2010-05-19 16:13 <prpplague> hehe, *cough* well it would be a hard sell to try and use avr32, hehe
2010-05-19 16:14 <kristianpaul> ;)
2010-05-19 16:15 <kristianpaul> that omap have built-in gps/wifi stuff?
2010-05-19 16:16 <prpplague> here are the specs we are looking at, omap4, HDMI w/audio, WL1271 wifi+bt, OTG slave/host port
2010-05-19 16:16 <kristianpaul> ohh
2010-05-19 16:16 <prpplague> the next get WL1283 chipset has gps/wifi/bt/FM rx.tx
2010-05-19 16:16 <kristianpaul> if just TI drop the price a bit ;)
2010-05-19 16:17 <kristianpaul> ohhh 1 Ghz + Dual core?
2010-05-19 16:17 <kristianpaul> what about power comsuption?
2010-05-19 16:18 <prpplague> i'm doing some tests now using the nanonote lcd and feature set using the 850mA battery for the nanonote
2010-05-19 16:18 <prpplague> we'll see
2010-05-19 20:39 <mirko_> anyone awake working on the pictureframe / openmotion?
2010-05-19 20:39 <mirko_> *openmotic
2010-05-19 22:39 <kristianpaul> ohhh lovelly http://en.qi-hardware.com/wiki/File:Ben_gmenu.JPG
2010-05-19 22:42 <kristianpaul> Yi thanks !
2010-05-19 22:46 <DocScrutinizer> hmm, seems you guys having fun with nanonote
2010-05-19 22:53 <kristianpaul> yeah !
2010-05-19 22:54 <kristianpaul> http://en.qi-hardware.com/wiki/File:Ben_stardict.JPG :)
2010-05-19 22:54 <kristianpaul> Yi !! :)
2010-05-19 23:45 <foxtrot> is there a mouse on the nanonote